"Soulful Old Man Sunshine" Reaction

[Magic City Surfer]

I wasn't deep into BB history or lore back in 1998, but I was blown away by this song when I listened to the soundtrack.

What was the reaction among hard core fandom? 
Had this been widely booted?
 If not, was anybody aware that it existed?
 In short, how surprised were you by it in 1998? 

I went from not ever hearing the faintest rumor of its existence to a complete mind-blowing revelation as I listened to it. Just wonder if it rocked the BB Fan world as much as it rocked mine at the time.

[Michael Edward Osbourne]

I hadn't heard of Soulful Old Man Sunshine until I bought Endless Harmony back in 1999. I, too, was fully blown away by how amazing the song was. It's definitely one of my favorite Beach Boys songs from the late 60s. I just love those incredible harmonies. I can't remember which book it was from...someone described it as sounding like a shampoo commercial. Whatever, I disagree. It's an incredible upbeat jazzy pop number. Carl's 'flubbing' (Shunshine) doesn't bug me in the least. Love it...

[Lee Marshall]

Liked it a LOT.  GLAD to have it now after the fact.  Maybe just a touch too 'bright' Sunflower?  Haven't really thought about dropping it in there 'til today.  Kind of lost in between projects like Breakaway, Lool De Loop and Celebrate the News.  Good tuneage but maybe not quite right for the album???

[Gregg]

Yes, I was definitely blown away the first time I heard it too. I was also unaware of it's existence. I thought it was a real missed opportunity for the band as well. It had such a full, spacious vocal sound. I think the general public would immeadiately recognize it as being The Beach Boys, yet it sounded unlike anything they had done up to that point.

And I think it would have fit in well with what was currently on the radio around 1969. It just had that vibe and sound. Think of "Build Me Up Buttercup", "Good Morning Starshine", "More Today Than Yesterday", and probably several others I can't remember right now.

[LeeDempsey]

Yes, I was definitely blown away the first time I heard it too. I was also unaware of it's existence. I thought it was a real missed opportunity for the band as well. It had such a full, spacious vocal sound. I think the general public would immeadiately recognize it as being The Beach Boys, yet it sounded unlike anything they had done up to that point.

And I think it would have fit in well with what was currently on the radio around 1969. It just had that vibe and sound. Think of "Build Me Up Buttercup", "Good Morning Starshine", "More Today Than Yesterday", and probably several others I can't remember right now.

I broke the scoop about "Soulful Old Man Sunshine" in ESQ in 1994.  I was in L.A. for the Brian Wilson Tribute at the Morgan-Wixon Theatre, and Elliot Kendall got me an invite to Rick Henn's house.  Before that I had scored a lead sheet for "Soulful" from Rockaway Records, and I had heard Manfred Schmidt's excellent, but slower-tempoed re-creation from the lead sheet on the IN MY ROOM tribute cassette (which Rick was very complimentary of).  But when Rick played me "Soulful," my jaw hit the floor.  I described it in as much detail as I could remember in the next issue of ESQ.  But I didn't hear it again until Endless Harmony was being compiled.

Hearing it for the first time at Rick's house is still one of the highlights of my time as a Beach Boys collector.

Lee

[runnersdialzero]

I can't believe it wasn't an A Side, let alone not being released at all for over a couple decades. I just can't fathom them letting this one slip away when they were all upset to one extent or another over their sales slipping so much at that point. I guess I can't say for sure if it would have been a huge seller or anything, but I still think it would have went down as a highlight of that era.

I think it would have been pretty perfect on Sunflower, maybe as a track 1 or 2 or as the opener for side B.

[Mikie]

Yes, I was definitely blown away the first time I heard it too. I was also unaware of it's existence. I thought it was a real missed opportunity for the band as well. It had such a full, spacious vocal sound. I think the general public would immeadiately recognize it as being The Beach Boys, yet it sounded unlike anything they had done up to that point.

And I think it would have fit in well with what was currently on the radio around 1969. It just had that vibe and sound. Think of "Build Me Up Buttercup", "Good Morning Starshine", "More Today Than Yesterday", and probably several others I can't remember right now.

I broke the scoop about "Soulful Old Man Sunshine" in ESQ in 1994.  I was in L.A. for the Brian Wilson Tribute at the El Ray Theatre, and Elliot Kendall got me an invite to Rick's House.  Before that I had scored a lead sheet for "Soulful" from Rockaway Records, and I had heard Manfred Schmidt's excellent, but slower-tempoed re-creation from the lead sheet (which Rick was very complimentary of).  But when Rick played me "Soulful," my jaw hit the floor.  I described it in as much detail as I could remember in ESQ.  But I didn't hear it again until Endless Harmony was being compiled.

Hearing it for the first time at Rick's house is still one of the highlights of my time as a Beach Boys collector.

Lee

You're talking about co-writer Rick Henn, right Lee?

Carl supposedly vetoed the song's inclusion from the Good Vibrations box set due to his singing Shunshine" instead of "Sunshine" about two minutes in. Less picky heads prevailed and it eventually came out on Endless Harmony five years later (soon after Carl passed).

[the captain]

I broke the scoop about "Soulful Old Man Sunshine" in ESQ in 1994.  I was in L.A. for the Brian Wilson Tribute at the El Ray Theatre, and Elliot Kendall got me an invite to Rick's House.  Before that I had scored a lead sheet for "Soulful" from Rockaway Records, and I had heard Manfred Schmidt's excellent, but slower-tempoed re-creation from the lead sheet (which Rick was very complimentary of).  But when Rick played me "Soulful," my jaw hit the floor.  I described it in as much detail as I could remember in ESQ.  But I didn't hear it again until Endless Harmony was being compiled.

Hearing it for the first time at Rick's house is still one of the highlights of my time as a Beach Boys collector.

Lee

That's really interesting. I came to the impression--from what I have read around here and on predecessor boards, I suppose--that the version on Endless Harmony was edited together and mixed from raw tapes without the Beach Boys' direct involvement, about which easily could be mistaken, as while I pay attention, I don't pretend to be a scholar about it. But if that's true (or even close to true), I guess I always assumed that happened somewhere near the time of that album, not five years earlier. Do you know or recall whether you heard the version used there, or some other, separately assembled version?

[LeeDempsey]

You're talking about co-writer Rick Henn, right Lee?

Yup, co-writer, arranger, and producer.

My iPad was fighting with me over the word "Henn," and it got deleted altogether.

[LeeDempsey]

That's really interesting. I came to the impression--from what I have read around here and on predecessor boards, I suppose--that the version on Endless Harmony was edited together and mixed from raw tapes without the Beach Boys' direct involvement, about which easily could be mistaken, as while I pay attention, I don't pretend to be a scholar about it. But if that's true (or even close to true), I guess I always assumed that happened somewhere near the time of that album, not five years earlier. Do you know or recall whether you heard the version used there, or some other, separately assembled version?

Mikie is correct; Rick (with Daryl Dragon) assembled his edit in 1993 for the GOOD VIBRATIONS box set, but it was rejected.  That's the version I heard, and that's the version Alan and Mark used on ENDLESS HARMONY.  But I think Rick also played Elliot and me some of the session outtakes.  I vaguely remember him playing a couple of attempts at the a cappella intro, with the guys laughing about how great it sounded.

Lee

(Dang, my iPad doesn't like "Mikie" either...)

[GhostyTMRS]

Yeah, a missed opportunity if there ever was one. I was blown away by it the first time I heard the Endless Harmony CD. That would've been the smash single the group needed had they been able to complete it.

[LeeDempsey]

Some great discussion about "Soulful Old Man Sunshine" from last year over on the Steve Hoffman board, including highlights from my interview with Rick Henn, and some great comments from Stephen Desper:

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/the-beach-boys-soulful-old-man-sunshine-whats-up-with-the-sound.276506/

[runnersdialzero]

Some great discussion about "Soulful Old Man Sunshine" from last year over on the Steve Hoffman board, including highlights from my interview with Rick Henn, and some great comments from Steve Desper:

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/the-beach-boys-soulful-old-man-sunshine-whats-up-with-the-sound.276506/

Thanks a lot for posting this!

The first post, about the phasing - it sounds like someone took a mono verse and tried to put it through some kind of filter to "stereoize" it to match the rest of the song. I really, really dislike this aspect of the mix. I edited the verse to be in true mono, and while it's not ideal, it sounds a lot better.

[LeeDempsey]

The first post, about the phasing - it sounds like someone took a mono verse and tried to put it through some kind of filter to "stereoize" it to match the rest of the song. I really, really dislike this aspect of the mix. I edited the verse to be in true mono, and while it's not ideal, it sounds a lot better.

You nailed it -- Stephen Desper goes on to talk about the use of the Orban Stereo Synthesizer on SOMS.

Lee

[Alan Smith]

Some great discussion about "Soulful Old Man Sunshine" from last year over on the Steve Hoffman board, including highlights from my interview with Rick Henn, and some great comments from Steve Desper:

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/the-beach-boys-soulful-old-man-sunshine-whats-up-with-the-sound.276506/

Thanks a lot for posting this!

Yeah, another big thanks - what a great read - and hopefully a study vid may one day be with us - thanks Lee and Stephen

[Gerry]

I have to say I love this song like it's nobodys business, however, I believe it would have tanked just like Breakaway did. Sad but true.

[LeeDempsey]

I have to say I love this song like it's nobodys business, however, I believe it would have tanked just like Breakaway did. Sad but true.

I totally agree.  What would have been de rigueur in, say, 1966, was unfortunately passé by 1969 (do I get bonus points for using two French phrases in the same sentence?).

I see that a lot in Brian's music.  "I Just Wasn't Made For These Times" is so accurate -- he was ahead of his time in so many ways, but behind the times in just as many others.

Lee

[bossaroo]

I was blown away by the tune, and it was basically used as the theme song for the Endless Harmony documentary, to great effect. It really sums up the Beach Boys sound in so many ways. Hard to believe it never got a proper release in the 7os. I'm skeptical that it would have made much of a dent in the charts, but who knows?

the demo is also a delight, Brian is in great form. I'd love to know who wrote what on this tune.

"one, two... a-one, two, three... take off!"

[Eric Aniversario]

This was unbooted, and there was a lot of fan anticipation when it was announced to be on the tracklist for Endless Harmony. That compilation ess such a treat for hardcore fans. Overall, the reception was positive when it came out, and it did live up to its by then legendary status (at least for most fans). I think that in terms of individual tracks, only WIBNTLA had more legendary status and anticipation leading up to its release.

[Jukka]

This song kicked my BB-obsession to the next level. I mean, I already knew they are the greatest band in the world with the best songs, but hearing this... When the voices come in one by one in the middle eight, it felt like somebody kicked down my inner door of perception, and then that "heyyyyyy" part, it was like an explosion of light fooding into my head.

So yeah, it definitely made an impact. Still one of my fave songs of all time.

[Autotune]

I read Lee's article on it in 1994. And shared the enormous anticipation among fans for this track.

A few years later I heard it and meh..... Overrated, if you ask me. Sometimes that happens when superfans hype the music they've just been privy to and you weren't. Happened with Lazy Lizzie. Happened with You've Lost that Lovin' Feelin'. Happened with the Paley sessions. Some of this music is good, or very good. Some of it I cherish. But the hype created for it, surpasses by far the actual results. MHO

[Micha]

I have to say I love this song like it's nobodys business, however, I believe it would have tanked just like Breakaway did. Sad but true.

I'm not so sure it would have tanked as much, but probably would not have gone to #1 either.

I was blown away, too, much more than by other tracks that were unearthed long after their time. It shows how good the boys were at that point to deliver such a performance on a song they're not interested in at all.

[LeeDempsey]

I read Lee's article on it in 1994. And shared the enormous anticipation among fans for this track.

A few years later I heard it and meh..... Overrated, if you ask me. Sometimes that happens when superfans hype the music they've just been privy to and you weren't. Happened with Lazy Lizzie. Happened with You've Lost that Lovin' Feelin'. Happened with the Paley sessions. Some of this music is good, or very good. Some of it I cherish. But the hype created for it, surpasses by far the actual results. MHO

We certainly can agree to disagree, because it was as exciting to me the second time I heard it (when Alan was compiling ENDLESS HARMONY) as it was the first time, four years earlier.  It still has a place on my one-CDR/80 minute compilation of my favorite Beach Boys tracks.

Lee

[The Shift]

My jaw dropped when I first heard this on the EH soundtrack. Outstanding, fully produced … etc etc etc. overjoyed it had reached my ears and was an utter surprise; but always wondered what impact it might have had at the time. I disagree that it sounds dated. It still sounds incredibly vibrant, and very optimistic to me.

[Autotune]

To each their own, I think. A bubblegum effort, overblown vocal arrangement, not much of a song in there, and a half-arsed lead from Carl. As exciting as it is to hear the busy vocal arrangement, I don't think there is much to this song.