The Smiley Smile Message Board

1. Don't Go Near The Water
2. Long Promised Road
3. Take A Load Off Your Feet
4. 4th of July
5. Student Demonstration Time
6. Feel Flows
7. Lookin' At Tomorrow (A Welfare Song)
8. Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again
9. 'Til I Die
10. Surf's Up


Wow. Just Wow.

Could "of," would "of," should "of."

I am havefended by your post.

1. Don't Go Near The Water
2. Long Promised Road
3. Take A Load Off Your Feet
4. 4th of July
5. Student Demonstration Time
6. Feel Flows
7. Lookin' At Tomorrow (A Welfare Song)
8. Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again
9. 'Til I Die
10. Surf's Up


Wow. Just Wow.

1. Don't Go Near The Water
2. Long Promised Road
3. Take A Load Off Your Feet
4. 4th of July
5. Student Demonstration Time
6. Feel Flows
7. Lookin' At Tomorrow (A Welfare Song)
8. Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again
9. 'Til I Die
10. Surf's Up


Wow. Just Wow.

 Come on. Do you really get a better SURF'S UP by ditching one of Brian's weirdest art songs and Bruce's hit?

Yes, when it's a little less embarrassing.

Am I the only one who finds Student Demonstration Time cringeworthy?

I count myself a fan of ADITLOAT; bleak, harkening, haunting, fragile, beautiful.

I'm one of the few people who think Brian was at his songwriting peak in the early 70s (quality wise, not quantity) and ADITLOAT was no exception. And Disney Girls was Bruce's finest moment.

Am I the only one who finds Student Demonstration Time cringeworthy?

I'll admit that the lyrics on SDT sound like they were made up as Mike sang. 

But, in all honesty, if you take away that godawful siren noise, and Mike sang into a microphone instead of a bull horn, it's a pretty good track.  I always wished they just did a straight cover of Riot in Cell Block B. 

First, Mike was "keeping it real" using a bullhorn, as campus police didn't use a mic, they used a bullhorn to disperse crowds, demonstrating.  The bullhorn replicated the sonoric intensity and fear that was the desired result of the police involvement.  One need only look at the demonstrations against law enforcement right now, as an analogy.

Second, it is highly doubtful Mike "made it up, as he went along..."

This song recognized what was going on at the time.  Having been in college at the time, and having witnessed that bullhorn, it added authenticity to the song.   Harsh, but appropriate.

I know the effect Mike was going for, but to me, the bullhorn and lyrics and just.......meh.   CSNY did a much better job with the same source material on "Ohio." 

How about we keep the bullhorn, but lose the sirens?  Or at least a better sounding siren effect? 

First, Mike was "keeping it real" using a bullhorn, as campus police didn't use a mic, they used a bullhorn to disperse crowds, demonstrating.  The bullhorn replicated the sonoric intensity and fear that was the desired result of the police involvement.  One need only look at the demonstrations against law enforcement right now, as an analogy.

Second, it is highly doubtful Mike "made it up, as he went along..."

This song recognized what was going on at the time.  Having been in college at the time, and having witnessed that bullhorn, it added authenticity to the song.   Harsh, but appropriate.

Take a Load off Your Feet is a fun, innocent song with some nice involvement from Brian. In a way it's pretty close to Vega-Tables and I'm sure the BB knew what they were doing when they decided to include it on Surf's Up.

 Come on. Do you really get a better SURF'S UP by ditching one of Brian's weirdest and greatest art songs and Bruce's greatest hit? I don't think so. Bonus tracks are always welcome but one does not improve the record by taking away. SURF'S UP is one of those rare albums that is undeniably great despite several flaws. Add "WIBNTLA" as a coda after "Surf's Up" and you've got a bona fide baroque pop masterpiece!

Regarding alternate track lists for albums... I get the idea of compiling them.  What I don't get is the exercise of removing tracks featured on those albums.  Weaknesses on Beach Boys albums from the 70s, to me, are due to what's missing, not what was included.  Albums like Surf's Up, Carl & The Passions, Holland, LA Light and Keepin' the Summer Alive benefit greatly from the addition of tracks recorded during those sessions but not included.  In particular, since first hearing LA and KTSA at the time of release, my reaction was, "Nice, but where's the rest of it?"

As for the record in question, the addition of 4th of July and WIBNTLA to Surf's Up turn it from a very good album into a great one.  But I can't think of a single track I'd remove.  They're all gems in their own way. 

Regarding alternate track lists for albums... I get the idea of compiling them.  What I don't get is the exercise of removing tracks featured on those albums.  Weaknesses on Beach Boys albums from the 70s, to me, are due to what's missing, not what was included.  Albums like Surf's Up, Carl & The Passions, Holland, LA Light and Keepin' the Summer Alive benefit greatly from the addition of tracks recorded during those sessions but not included.  In particular, since first hearing LA and KTSA at the time of release, my reaction was, "Nice, but where's the rest of it?"

As for the record in question, the addition of 4th of July and WIBNTLA to Surf's Up turn it from a very good album into a great one.  But I can't think of a single track I'd remove.  They're all gems in their own way. 

Agreed. Well said!

SDT "should of" never been. It's a rocker but the lyrics are in poor taste and rather offensive. Mike Love really has no business writing protest lyrics.

SDT "should of" never been. It's a rocker but the lyrics are in poor taste and rather offensive. Mike Love really has no business writing protest lyrics.

Regarding alternate track lists for albums... I get the idea of compiling them.  What I don't get is the exercise of removing tracks featured on those albums.  Weaknesses on Beach Boys albums from the 70s, to me, are due to what's missing, not what was included.  Albums like Surf's Up, Carl & The Passions, Holland, LA Light and Keepin' the Summer Alive benefit greatly from the addition of tracks recorded during those sessions but not included.  In particular, since first hearing LA and KTSA at the time of release, my reaction was, "Nice, but where's the rest of it?"

As for the record in question, the addition of 4th of July and WIBNTLA to Surf's Up turn it from a very good album into a great one.  But I can't think of a single track I'd remove.  They're all gems in their own way. 

This is my ideal track listing for Surf's Up:

1. Don't Go Near The Water
2. Long Promised Road
3. Take A Load Off Your Feet
4. Disney Girls (1957)
5. Student Demonstration Time
6. Feel Flows
7. Lookin' At Tomorrow (A Welfare Song)
8. A Day In The Life Of A Tree
9. 'Til I Die
10. Surf's Up

I have a hard time understanding all the hate around here for SDT, yet the same folks seem to have no problem with the wretched "Don't Go Near the Water", especially as an opening track.  SDT is by no means a great song, but I find it pretty harmless for the most part.  I certainly wouldn't want it as an opener, but I could tolerate it over DGNtW, which has got to be one of the BB's biggest downers.   I remember the first time I listened to the Surfs Up album several years ago, and I'm glad I listened to a few more cuts after DGNtW, because initially I was nearly done with the album part way into that song.

I have a hard time understanding all the hate around here for SDT, yet the same folks seem to have no problem with the wretched "Don't Go Near the Water", especially as an opening track.  SDT is by no means a great song, but I find it pretty harmless for the most part.  I certainly wouldn't want it as an opener, but I could tolerate it over DGNtW, which has got to be one of the BB's biggest downers.   I remember the first time I listened to the Surfs Up album several years ago, and I'm glad I listened to a few more cuts after DGNtW, because initially I was nearly done with the album part way into that song.

Why? Don't Go Near the Water sounds like classic BB to me, in fact I think it's so catchy it could be a Brian song. Great backing track too!

I commented on this in my book.  The world was a different place then.  Vietnam war in full gear.  You think the body count is high now?  How about several thousand a week.  Passions were running high, for and against the war, but the stakes were much higher.  Protests happened everywhere, even at Beach Boy concerts.  Carl was tagged to go into the army. Students were being killed on their collage campus' for protesting (and by American soldiers). This is serious stuff!  Although the group's sentiment was anti-war, they did not take a political stand at their concerts.  However, many in the crowd did with signs and chants, even with the ever present armed police monitors.  Michael's song is about keeping your cool when you demonstrate as a student. Listen to the words.  When the record was released this song was very appropos.  Kent State was in the news. Tensions were high.

Michael was moved to make a verbal comment about what was happening at the moment, in this song.  And like the fashions of the day, time moves along and things change. Like bellbottom pants and long hair, the song seems, in the light of today, not to quite fit into our views of things, to be   There are no riots in the streets -- THERE IS NOT DRAFT and soldiers are not dying at a rate of hundred's per day. Beach Boy concerts are not being turned into political statements by their patrons.  Yet the song is part of that album, and always will be. At the time of release it made more sense, so take it in context. Look at old movies of the 40's and 50's. Do you discount their excellence because everyone is smoking in them?  Times change.  King Soloman (of the Bible) had many wives, yet we consider him a wise leader and ponder his words to this day. Customs change too. 

Student Demonstration Time was set in a collage campus assembly field surrounded by stately buildings. Michael took the part of a demonstration organizer giving a lecture to a crowd about "keeping cool" during riots.  You can hear the sirens in the background, and sometimes in your face, reminding us of how involved the issues were.  Michael felt that he could use his influence as a "rock personality" to temper the attitude of some of the youth toward uncivil behavor -- especially by performing the song at key times in concerts -- by delivering this message in a song. 

Rather than putting down the song or skipping over it when you play Surf's Up, try doing a little research into the period of the music.  Do a word search for Kent State and People's park. 

Maybe look at some old news reels.  Try to imagine the smell of tear gas at a rock concert or close your eyes when you listen to SDT and hear the shouting of fans going on all about you with a sense of danger that you could be caught up in a riot and beaten with a police club. Learn to appreciate the song for what it says and tries to do.  I don't thing a surf song or balled is the right medium to convay the thought that Mike had with this song.  I think if you consider the context more you will learn to actually like the song.  ~swd       

I have a hard time understanding all the hate around here for SDT, yet the same folks seem to have no problem with the wretched "Don't Go Near the Water", especially as an opening track.  SDT is by no means a great song, but I find it pretty harmless for the most part.  I certainly wouldn't want it as an opener, but I could tolerate it over DGNtW, which has got to be one of the BB's biggest downers.   I remember the first time I listened to the Surfs Up album several years ago, and I'm glad I listened to a few more cuts after DGNtW, because initially I was nearly done with the album part way into that song.

1. Don't Go Near The Water
2. Long Promised Road
3. Take A Load Off Your Feet
4. 4th of July
5. Student Demonstration Time
6. Feel Flows
7. Lookin' At Tomorrow (A Welfare Song)
8. Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again
9. 'Til I Die
10. Surf's Up


Wow. Just Wow.

Stephen Desper has commented about the intentions behind Student Demonstration Time in the past:

I didn't used to like Don't Go Near the Water, but it's kinda grown on me.  The song's saving grace is really the wordless vocal coda. 

1. Don't Go Near The Water
2. Long Promised Road
3. Take A Load Off Your Feet
4. 4th of July
5. Student Demonstration Time
6. Feel Flows
7. Lookin' At Tomorrow (A Welfare Song)
8. Wouldn't It Be Nice To Live Again
9. 'Til I Die
10. Surf's Up


Wow. Just Wow.

Hope you've heard the MIC version, track only, no vocals.  Brilliant.  ;)

SDT "should of" never been. It's a rocker but the lyrics are in poor taste and rather offensive. Mike Love really has no business writing protest lyrics.

Am I the only one who finds Student Demonstration Time cringeworthy?

I think Disney Girls and "Tree" are classics that deserve to be on the album.

Am I the only one who finds Student Demonstration Time cringeworthy?

No.  You are not.    although this song was the first to catch my attention back in the early70's when I was introduced to the album, in time it became a sort of embarrassing cringeworthy piece.    Initially it may have helped sell the record but in retrospect it is just as silly as any of the other counter culture pop shite of the day on an otherwise relatively solid album release that still stands.  to be fair, the BB were not the only band that did that back in the day to get in a catchy and suburban counterculture sounding song.