The Beach Boys Love You

[monkee knutz]

Yeah, I'd have to give PARTY a 5 as well! 

[APPLEI]

the most under rated album in the history of recorded music!
i give it 5 stars

[the captain]

the most under rated album in the history of recorded music!
i give it 5 stars

There's a certain point when enough people talk about how under-appreciated something is when it stops being so. I believe it isn't a hidden gem anymore (if it once was). People love it or hate it, but if you're a fan, you've heard it.

[monkee knutz]

OK... I now understand the fascination with this LP (I'm being serious, now- not in normal smart-ass mode).
I see how some might equate it to SMiLEy and that's how this revelation came upon me.
Both are intimate & sparse in terms of instrumentation. Both are handsome in terms of vocal arrangement. Both were co-written& fully produced by a man who at the time of SMiLEy, was tired of working his anus off in the studio for something that never came to full fruition. Frustrated by this, a made a more laid-back LP came out of it's shadows. Love You is similar in that his bandmates wanted to see more of him. Under some pressure, he felt somewhat obliged to lend a hand. But, at the same time the effort to produce a 'bigger' album might have been out of the question both in terms of Brian's energy & ability considerating his physical & mental state.

Now in my ears (the disclaimer!), Love You is unintentionally wanting to be a more hip version of SMiLEy and not quite making the grade. A few simple songs (almost too simple). A few child-like tunes. A few faltered attempts at bigger production that almost make it. Nearly 10 Years after SMiLEy, the effects of excessive booze, drugs, & smokes have now altered the voices of Brian & Denny, thusly putting a bit of a damper on the album for me. The harmonies are not what they should/could be. If your voice is your bread & butter, wouldn't you want to take care of it?

After 'getting' what Love You is about, seeing why so many of you like it and realizing why this is the case, I still stand firm in stating that it's not my cup of meat. For a group that was once on top- it still sounds rushed to me. More demo-like than a real finished product ONLY knowing what they were capable of, collectively. It's certainly got it's moments, but for me... it falls flat. Again, I don't hate it, I just don't like it. It works in parts, but not as a whole.

Something else that dawns on me- why didn't Ten Years Of Harmony contain more Love You tracks? Only Roller Skatin' Child made the cut. Seems to me that an album that is revered as highly as Love You, should have better representation on a 70's 'hits' 2 LP-er. Wuzzup?

[Mitchell]

Because Love You, like Today, is meant to be heard as a full album!! It's all about context.

Actually, speaking of which, when I was first listening to the GV Box I was thinking "These songs are all really cool! Who says the later-period sucks?" I listened to the Love You songs in particular and they really struck me. I was happy that the rest of the album was as cool.

[Jason]

Now in my ears (the disclaimer!), Love You is unintentionally wanting to be a more hip version of SMiLEy and not quite making the grade. A few simple songs (almost too simple). A few child-like tunes. A few faltered attempts at bigger production that almost make it. Nearly 10 Years after SMiLEy, the effects of excessive booze, drugs, & smokes have now altered the voices of Brian & Denny, thusly putting a bit of a damper on the album for me. The harmonies are not what they should/could be. If your voice is your bread & butter, wouldn't you want to take care of it?

Brian did everything in his power to destroy his voice because he was trying to sabotage the group's career. It worked, he robbed the band (and himself) of sweet falsetto. Note that Brian isn't really singing too well on either 15 Big Ones or Love You, again, that's Brian sticking it to the group. There may be a cult around Love You, but there is the undeniable fact that it was just one more attempt by Brian Wilson to sabotage the band who he felt betrayed him.

[I. Spaceman]

Because Love You, like Today, is meant to be heard as a full album!! It's all about context.

Actually, speaking of which, when I was first listening to the GV Box I was thinking "These songs are all really cool! Who says the later-period sucks?" I listened to the Love You songs in particular and they really struck me. I was happy that the rest of the album was as cool.

Same here!

[monkee knutz]

Because Love You, like Today, is meant to be heard as a full album!! It's all about context.

Actually, speaking of which, when I was first listening to the GV Box I was thinking "These songs are all really cool! Who says the later-period sucks?" I listened to the Love You songs in particular and they really struck me. I was happy that the rest of the album was as cool.

Curious!
To me, several of the tracks stand better alone than the album does as a whole. Too many dead spots that make me want the next track to come up. Hey Jason, if Brian was trying to sabotage the band with his vocal, maybe his attempt to make the entire album weird, ala: keybass, lack of BIG harmonies, lack of truly good songs, so that the general public would stay away. Sabotage might have been the intent at the time, but it is now his favorite album, and a good number of fans as well. That I find Interesting.

[artie]

Brian did everything in his power to destroy his voice because he was trying to sabotage the group's career. It worked, he robbed the band (and himself) of sweet falsetto. Note that Brian isn't really singing too well on either 15 Big Ones or Love You, again, that's Brian sticking it to the group. There may be a cult around Love You, but there is the undeniable fact that it was just one more attempt by Brian Wilson to sabotage the band who he felt betrayed him.

Now THAT is a radical statement. I've heard, read, and seen alot about Brian but I have never seen anyone go quite that far. He is trying to "stick it to" and "sabotage" the band with Love You? God, I wish my hostility was so beautiful and great to listen to. Brian and Dennis both trashed their voices (Denny moreso, it was a croak by about '80), but Brian kept writing great stuff. Love You, in my opinion, is tied with Today as 2nd best album, right after Pet Sounds. I think the "cult" description may apply to Smiley Smile, which is an acquired taste, but not Love You.

By the way, this discourse is great. I am of the understanding that all disagreement and discussion is respectful and appreciated. I am new to this but have been a huge fan for 20 years and it's nice to discuss this with other fanatics.

[Mitchell]

I don't think it has to do with "sabotage" but more just "leave me be in the studio and this is what I'll do". I really think Brian loved to sing those songs which is a quality I love on the album. He may not be trying to be perfect but he's enjoying himself. On the flipside, he really pours his heart and soul into some of the songs (The Night Was So Young, Let's Put Our Hearts Together) and I don't think those are in any way sabotage. So you have some 'silly' fun songs and you have some real emotional depth on the album. Sounds like The Beach Boys to me. If the presentation's a problem (i.e., people want better singing or less synths), well, there's not much you can do about it. I happen to love it.

[Old Rake]

undeniable fact that it was just one more attempt by Brian Wilson to sabotage the band who he felt betrayed him.

I certainly deny that fact!!

There is, as Ian will undoubtedly soon point out if he hasn't already, a direct line that ties together Party with Smiley SMile with lots of Brian's late-60s tracks with the Fairy Tale with Love You. That's just one aspect of Brian's creative mind -- the side that ISN'T the "meticulous layered production" side. In many ways, he can't do one without the other, and when he pushes too hard on either one side he ends up with crap. The balance between the two is necessary. WHich is why this album WOULD have been followed up with Adult Child, the new songs of which were again sophisticated and layered.

[Chris D.]

Brian did everything in his power to destroy his voice because he was trying to sabotage the group's career. It worked, he robbed the band (and himself) of sweet falsetto. Note that Brian isn't really singing too well on either 15 Big Ones or Love You, again, that's Brian sticking it to the group. There may be a cult around Love You, but there is the undeniable fact that it was just one more attempt by Brian Wilson to sabotage the band who he felt betrayed him.

Aw hell no.  Sabotage with their best work???  Not right.  If anything was sabotage, it was "Gettin' Hungry."  Not this.  You honestly think he spent years in bed just to ruin his voice so the band would be f***ed, even though their status had already declined?

[monkee knutz]

Destroy himself for revenge- does seem a bit 'out there.'

[I. Spaceman]

undeniable fact that it was just one more attempt by Brian Wilson to sabotage the band who he felt betrayed him.

I certainly deny that fact!!

There is, as Ian will undoubtedly soon point out if he hasn't already, a direct line that ties together Party with Smiley SMile with lots of Brian's late-60s tracks with the Fairy Tale with Love You. That's just one aspect of Brian's creative mind -- the side that ISN'T the "meticulous layered production" side. In many ways, he can't do one without the other, and when he pushes too hard on either one side he ends up with crap. The balance between the two is necessary. WHich is why this album WOULD have been followed up with Adult Child, the new songs of which were again sophisticated and layered.

Yep, that's about it, man.

[the captain]

I'm not in a position to know what Brian's intentions are, were or ever shall be (same as most of you), but I find it difficult to believe Brian disliked the material on Love You, or put it out in a fashion so as to "sabotage" anything. It is certainly possible that he knew it wasn't what the bulk of the band would like, or that the public would like, but didn't care. It is also possible that he didn't know that.

But many of those songs have as much spirit in them as any of the hits from a decade before. "Honkin..." and "Roller Skatin' Chilld" and the like are the "I Get Around" and "Help Me, Rhonda" songs of the time for Brian. They fvcking rock. If he were going to sabotage, why use true, developed and originally produced music? Why not just make dissonance or feedback (Hi, I'm Lou Reed, and this is Metal Machine Music...sorry, Ian.) This is a real album, and a damn good one.

[Chris D.]

Soda Machine Music?

[Sheriff John Stone]

Brian did everything in his power to destroy his voice because he was trying to sabotage the group's career. /quote]

I don't think Brian intentionally sabotaged the Beach Boys or the LOVE YOU album. I believe Brian awoke from a deep, deep sleep in 1976, re-emerging as a very damaged man, as well as a damaged artist. It's almost as if he lost touch with reality. One can't listen to the vocals on "Solar System" or "Let's Put Our Hearts Together" and wonder how he (or Carl) could allow them to be released. They're downright embarrassing, especially coming from the master himself. Unfortunately, I find this characteristic (losing touch with reality) present throughout much of Brian's solo career. I find a lot of his solo work - on record, in concert, on TV, in print - to very unsettling.

That being said, LOVE YOU is in my top 3-4 favorite Beach Boys' albums. Luther was right, some of those songs are on a par with his earlier, classic material. I was around when LOVE YOU came out, and I truly believed Brian was on his way back. There was still a spark of that old Brian magic (yes, genius) in those songs. Who would've thought that it would've been mostly all down hill from there, at least creatively speaking...

[I. Spaceman]

Soda Machine Music?

Dude, I am so stealing that! Don't worry, I'll credit you.

[Chris D.]

Soda Machine Music?

Dude, I am so stealing that! Don't worry, I'll credit you.

Haha   And make sure it rocks like Love You.

[I. Spaceman]

Maybe it should be a cover of the entire Love You album. Roller Blading Child!

[Chris D.]

An industrial interpretation of Love You.

[Jeff Mason]

I have said it before and I will say it again -- Smiley SMile and Love You must be seen as two sides of the same coin.  They both are pretty much unfiltered Brian Wilson making music for himself.  The pre-Pet Sounds music was Brian being commercial, or doing songs that were a blend of his *musical* vision mixed with the words of others.  PS is Brian with a professional writer speaking for him in more generally accepted terms.  But Smiley Smile is the Brian that started to be seen in hints in "Guess I'm Dumb" -- the insecure goofy person who loves birthday cake, who when meeting the Queen of England says "Hi, Queen".  In other words, the Brian we all know and mostly love.  Both Smiley and Love You had Brian doing most of the instruments and writing most of the lyrics (I think -- I question how much of the Mike Love credits were really him, especially She's Going Bald).  I find that most people who love one love the other and vice versa.  But they certainly are as raw and exposed in their own way as the more celebrated Plastic Ono Band -- and I would argue that they are better than that album.  To appreciate POB you must know John's history (how else could "God" have any meaning?), but Smiley and Love You are self-contained.

[Jason]

I knew those comments were going to be controversial. I stand by them, however, and am willing to back them up for those who don't believe me.

Based on what I've read and heard from various sources, Brian Wilson, after 1967, was intentionally trying to ruin the Beach Boys. He felt betrayed and beaten down by the whole Smile experience and was obviously hellbent on revenge, in removing himself as the group's producer since he knew none of them would be up to the challenge and releasing the very stripped-down Smiley Smile and Wild Honey as the group's first two albums after the Smile fiasco. I think Brian was intentionally trying to ruin the group's sound (not to mention credibility with Smiley Smile, which a lot of people still to this day do not understand). When he did participate, it was in a lazy manner. I believe the "misplaced" master for Do It Again can lay claim to having some kind of Brian Wilson involvement.

When Brian regained himself in 1975 and started production on 15 Big Ones, you'll note his horrible vocals on that album. Not that his voice wasn't already shot from years of smoking and drug abuse, but he was literally singing like sh*t. He was trying to confuse the band and confuse their fans. 15 Big Ones was a rollicking success despite these efforts, although many would attribute that to the steam they had going from Endless Summer and the beginnings of the nostalgia run. Love You, however, wasn't met with the commercial success that greeted 15 Big Ones. People just did not get it (and some still don't!).

Brian may have been a very damaged man, but I believe there was a method to his madness, and by all means, it worked. His productions after 1967 did much to confuse the fans. Hell, they confuse me! But alas, I was not around when these albums were released, this is just one guy shooting off his opinion. Take it as you will, I can't tell you what to do, but I stick behind what I said.

[I. Spaceman]

Well, even I disagree with you, but you stated your thoughts very well, man.

[the captain]

No question, and I've heard that opinion, too. It might be right, and Jason makes a good point. But Love You is SO FVCKING GOOD...I'd say it proves that Brian can't fvck up, but, well, I've heard too many examples of him sucking.