Brian comments in Pulse 1988

[Ian]

Thought I'd initiate a little conversation.  In 1988 Brian gave one of his most interesting interviews to Pulse Magazine (put out by the now defunct Tower Records).  Here is an excerpt-what do you think?
"There are so many mixed feelings in the Beach Boys that I can't handle it.  I don't like it.  I don't like the way it feels, so I just canned it and said that I don't want to do very many shows with them.  I stopped worrying about Mike Love and Carl Wilson and those guys and started worrying about myself.  If there's a fight, that would be very discomforting, but if there is, there is. 
When I show up to a concert, I feel their resentment.  I feel like they think 'Oh he gets to come out whenever he wants to but we have to work all year.' Little do they know I'm under just as much pressure as they are.  I think the Beach Boys are playing fear games with me.  They write letters to Gene and other people saying, 'We don't think Brian should get a share (of concert income) because he's not on the road.'  It makes me feared out.  They know it's going to fear me out when they do that because their touring is my only source of income. 
If it's going to come to those kind of games, I'll bow out entirely.  I will not participate in a group that plays games like that.  If they tell me to my face they want to do something with me (that's one thing), but if it's through letters to Gene and other people, I won't do it. I'd rather just go in and do my second album and f.... off with the Beach Boys.  It's not worth it to me to go through that much s..... 
The Beach Boys probably feel a little shackled too, when every night they've got to do '409' and 'Shut Down' and 'Surfin Safari.'  They have to do all those songs and they hate it, but that's what made them famous so they've got to do it.  I think the guys would much rather do some of the album cuts that we've done over the years, but they do those stupid old songs that sound for s....  They sound real stupid."
Brian then told the interviewer that the BBs shelved a great commercial song called "Boys, Girls" in the late 70s due to group tensions.  "It was a real commercial little song, but we threw it in the can.  We never did anything with it.  Why not?  I don't know.  Everyone just got crazy.  I got all screwed up. We sort of felt sour grapes about what was happening with us.  The LA (Light Album) didn't sell and it had a f....in'  great couple of songs on it.  We were looking for a big record with that one.  That set us back a little bit when that album bombed."

Anyways-I don't necessarily agree with all Brian says-but it has to be admitted its a very lucid and surprisisingly verbose and interesting interview.  Certainly far more frank, open and verbose than he has been in most interviews the last ten years or so.

[Ian]

At the end there-just to correct the quote-he said "it got all screwed up" not "I got all screwed up"

[Ron]

Some of the complexities I'm sure of dealing with a bunch of egos, and the mental issues and drug issues some of the members have.  I can completely understand why they stopped working together.

[Wirestone]

You fill somebody full of speed and they'll talk.

[alanjames]

Reading this, you'll understand why Brian don't want to be a part of reunion with the Boys, and if he'll refuse to work with Mike Love on new songs.
It's a mix of mostly bad things and bad feelings, and a little bit of good feelings and good memories.

[Cam Mott]

There are two sides to every relationship, this is just one side's story. I'm sure the Boys had equally sympathic stories about what a jerk Brian and Gene could be.

[Wirestone]

Frankly, this reads like Brian was 1.) both pumped full of stimulants (which Landy did repeatedly to him before interviews and performances) and 2.) repeating a Landy party line. Does this sound at all like BW?

The Beach Boys probably feel a little shackled too, when every night they've got to do '409' and 'Shut Down' and 'Surfin Safari.'  They have to do all those songs and they hate it, but that's what made them famous so they've got to do it.  I think the guys would much rather do some of the album cuts that we've done over the years, but they do those stupid old songs that sound for s....  They sound real stupid."

This sounds like something Brian was told. To me. I think he's pretty proud of some of those old songs -- at least these days.

[Myk Luhv]

Didn't Stebbins note, in his book on Dennis, that all of the Wilsons did, in fact, hate how 'The Beach Boys' became a touring oldies revue and they wanted to perform songs that were not just "409" and "Surfin' USA" and whatever -- deeper album cuts, new songs, and so on? That aspect of his comments at least doesn't seem that outlandish, I think.

[Ron]

I'm sure Brian was high and repeating the party line, but most people's minds work with kind of an all-encompassing judgement of everything.


What I mean by that is, even if Landy told Brian that Carl resented him.... it wouldn't have been the first time Brian thought about that.  So you can blame Landy, but I'm sure Brian truly did feel like Carl and the others resented him when he showed up and hadn't worked for months.  He actually sounds in this interview like he understand where they're coming from.

Like said above, two sides to every story.  This doesn't surprise me, it just surprises me that Brian was so honest to a reporter about what he felt.  He usually gives guarded interviews where he shares nothing that means anything. 

[Andrew G. Doe]

Reading this, you'll understand why Brian don't want to be a part of reunion with the Boys, and if he'll refuse to work with Mike Love on new songs.
It's a mix of mostly bad things and bad feelings, and a little bit of good feelings and good memories.

Two observations:

1 - that was over 20 years ago.

2 - I'll wager a large sum that Brian was just spouting what he'd been told to say. Can you say "Eugene Ellsworth Landy" ?  

[phirnis]

First time ever I've read a comment on the Light Album by Brian. Never knew it was such an important album for the group, but I suppose it makes perfect sense. Too bad the whole thing didn't work out.

[Jim V.]

Speaking of this article, what is the deal with "Boys and Girls" or whatever it is? Is there a finished recording in the vaults? Or is there a Brian demo out there. I've heard it talked up sometimes as a good song. Anybody got any info on it? When it was recorded, who was involved, leads, producers?

Anyways, I think that the Boys should have done an album in '81 or '82 with all the little gems Brian was writing around this period. There were quite a few little things that he was working on that could have been pretty commercial (if polished up) and pretty interesting artistically. You could have had an album with cuts like "Boys and Girls", "Sweetie", "Stevie", "I'm Begging You Please" and maybe "California Feelin'" from Brian, maybe "Why Don't They Let Us Fall in Love" and "Be My Baby" from those Brian/Mike sessions (hopefully sparing us LBWL in the process), "Heaven" from Carl (sparing us his debut), and maybe a few choice cuts from Bambu. Could have been a decently strong album. If only...

[Andrew G. Doe]

Speaking of this article, what is the deal with "Boys and Girls" or whatever it is? Is there a finished recording in the vaults? Or is there a Brian demo out there. I've heard it talked up sometimes as a good song. Anybody got any info on it? When it was recorded, who was involved, leads, producers?

Recorded October 19th 1979 and November 18th the following year, both times at Western.

[Jim V.]

Speaking of this article, what is the deal with "Boys and Girls" or whatever it is? Is there a finished recording in the vaults? Or is there a Brian demo out there. I've heard it talked up sometimes as a good song. Anybody got any info on it? When it was recorded, who was involved, leads, producers?

Recorded October 19th 1979 and November 18th the following year, both times at Western.

Was it finished? Have our beloved vault combers found it. And who did the lead? Brian i presume?

[Andrew G. Doe]

Speaking of this article, what is the deal with "Boys and Girls" or whatever it is? Is there a finished recording in the vaults? Or is there a Brian demo out there. I've heard it talked up sometimes as a good song. Anybody got any info on it? When it was recorded, who was involved, leads, producers?

Recorded October 19th 1979 and November 18th the following year, both times at Western.

Was it finished? Have our beloved vault combers found it.

Well, let's put it this way - I didn't pull those dates out of thin air. 

[Rocker]

First, thanks Ian for this article !

I stopped worrying about Mike Love and Carl Wilson and those guys and started worrying about myself. 

Would Brian mention his brother as "Carl Wilson"? Every time I heard him talk about his brothers, he just mentioned the first name

[Jon Stebbins]

Regardless of whether Brian was parroting someone else or not...its a fact that the commercial failure of L.A. Light was a HUGE disappointment for the band, the label, and anyone else connected to it. This was their CBS debut after being given a large advance and signed in a high industry profile. Although the band stumbled delivering the debut LP on time, and although it admittedly had about four great tracks, CBS and the Beach Boys ate dirt when it not only didn't make the top 40...it didn't make the top 99. A massive promo campaign was pumped into the LP and especially the 1st single, you can still find promo material by the container full for this(see ebay) picture discs, colored vinyl promo 12"s, posters, t-shirts, visors, promo singles, radio was bombarded with this stuff, as was the print media, plus high profile TV shows(midnight special), radio interviews by the dozen, the single was added to an impressive number of radio stations, a Radio City Music Hall kickoff, joint record store signings by ALL SIX Beach Boys!!!...and then people heard the goods... "Here Comes The Night" disco...THUD! Despite the largest promo campaign for the BB's since...don't say Brian's Back because that was a media campaign driven by the band's management...Reprise didn't do much like usual...and 15 BO's/R&R Music's success was at least partially radio driven...but L.A. Light was pushed by the label like one of those commercial's by Billy Mays(RIP). They did house-calls and shoved the thing under your front door(practically). People rejected it, yawned at it, and more than a few verbally eviscerated it for the inclusion of a 12 minute disco mistake(cue 11 people saying, "but I loved that track"...) "Good Timin'" did decent considering the BB's popularity cliff dive that occurred right before it was released as a single,  but it was too late, KTSA had no chance and was weak anyway. And then years before they whimpered to a CBS contract close with BB's 85. L.A. Light showed just how fast you can fritter away a label's hope, a fanbase's patience, and the media's interest. It was an epic disaster...oh...and the last partially good BB's LP.

[BJL]

Regardless of whether Brian was parroting someone else or not...its a fact that the commercial failure of L.A. Light was a HUGE disappointment for the band, the label, and anyone else connected to it. This was their CBS debut after being given a large advance and signed in a high industry profile. Although the band stumbled delivering the debut LP on time, and although it admittedly had about four great tracks, CBS and the Beach Boys ate dirt when it not only didn't make the top 40...it didn't make the top 99. A massive promo campaign was pumped into the LP and especially the 1st single, you can still find promo material by the container full for this(see ebay) picture discs, colored vinyl promo 12"s, posters, t-shirts, visors, promo singles, radio was bombarded with this stuff, as was the print media, plus high profile TV shows(midnight special), radio interviews by the dozen, the single was added to an impressive number of radio stations, a Radio City Music Hall kickoff, joint record store signings by ALL SIX Beach Boys!!!...and then people heard the goods... "Here Comes The Night" disco...THUD! Despite the largest promo campaign for the BB's since...don't say Brian's Back because that was a media campaign driven by the band's management...Reprise didn't do much like usual...and 15 BO's/R&R Music's success was at least partially radio driven...but L.A. Light was pushed by the label like one of those commercial's by Billy Mays(RIP). They did house-calls and shoved the thing under your front door(practically). People rejected it, yawned at it, and more than a few verbally eviscerated it for the inclusion of a 12 minute disco mistake(cue 11 people saying, "but I loved that track"...) "Good Timin'" did decent considering the BB's popularity cliff dive that occurred right before it was released as a single,  but it was too late, KTSA had no chance and was weak anyway. And then years before they whimpered to a CBS contract close with BB's 85. L.A. Light showed just how fast you can fritter away a label's hope, a fanbase's patience, and the media's interest. It was an epic disaster...oh...and the last partially good BB's LP.

Question: do you think if Good Timin had been the first single getting all of that hype, things would have been different?  It would be sad to think that all they had to do to have a hit album in the late 70s was swap the first and second single, but the way you just described it, it seems plausable.

[adamghost]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say I think the big mistake was in withdrawing the HCTN single.  I remember that getting a lot of play at the time and the edited version sounded GREAT on the radio...Carl's vocal just leapt out of the speakers and the whole thing sounded really edgy.  IIRC it peaked out at #44, but if they'd stuck with the single and it had gone higher, it could have easily set up "Good Timin'" to do better.

Now, my understanding of how it all went down could be totally wrong, but if it's true they pulled HCTN while it was climbing, then I think it was a very bad move.  My recollection was the song was getting a decent amount of play and the production value on it did a lot to restore the impression of the BBs as a current band.

[c-man]

Speaking of this article, what is the deal with "Boys and Girls" or whatever it is? Is there a finished recording in the vaults? Or is there a Brian demo out there. I've heard it talked up sometimes as a good song. Anybody got any info on it? When it was recorded, who was involved, leads, producers?

You must've missed the recent post on this topic...here's what Alan Boyd had to say:  "At one point, it was listed under the title 'Boys and Girls Living Together.'  We have the unfinished backing track from the KTSA sessions.  Very nice, upbeat, with some cool changes.  It was one of the tracks I brought along for the listening session when Steve Desper and I went to Susan Lang's fan gathering in Connecticut some years ago."

The 1979 version was produced by Bruce, and the players were Gary Mallaber (drums), Jerry Scheff (bass), Billy House (guitar), and Mike Meros, Brian Wilson, and Bruce Johnston (keyboards).  The 1980 version was produced by Brian, and the players were Ron Tutt (drums), Stephens LaFever (bass), Ed Carter (guitar), Mike Meros and probably Brian Wilson (keyboards), Carl Fortina (accordion), and Steve Douglas and Jay Migliori (saxes).  Chuck Britz engineered both versions.

[Jay]

Man, why can't they play something like the disco version of Here Comes The Night on the radio today?   I've been hard on the song in the past, but I must admit that a tastefully done edit of about four minutes or so would make it a pretty damn good song. The "dit dit dit" background vocals, against a pounding bass driven beat, culminating in Carl's hard edged vocals(especially in the chorus) is actually quite kick ass, now that I truly listen to the song. It's easy to just go along with the rest of the negative comments. The Beach Boys, and DISCO? That's the most ridiculous idea ever. But when you actually PAY ATTENTION to it, it's quite well done.

[Ian]

That is true of a lot of BB music-out of step with the times it was released but great today.  I mean-I like the Friends album-but I also am sharp enough to recognize that it was not a commercial release in early 1968.  Did not help the 1968 Beach Boys at all.  I actually really like Wild Honey as well-but in the fall of 67 the world wanted a much more dynamic statement from Brian.  Really-I think that if Brian had gotten a 4 minute single version of "Can't wait Too Long" together in the fall of 67-it might have been the right release.

[Jon Stebbins]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say I think the big mistake was in withdrawing the HCTN single.  I remember that getting a lot of play at the time and the edited version sounded GREAT on the radio...Carl's vocal just leapt out of the speakers and the whole thing sounded really edgy.  IIRC it peaked out at #44, but if they'd stuck with the single and it had gone higher, it could have easily set up "Good Timin'" to do better.

Now, my understanding of how it all went down could be totally wrong, but if it's true they pulled HCTN while it was climbing, then I think it was a very bad move.  My recollection was the song was getting a decent amount of play and the production value on it did a lot to restore the impression of the BBs as a current band.

We must have been on different planets...because when HCTN was released I was a 22 year old musician playing clubs all over L.A. and making records. I was REALLY paying attention to trends and radio, and music press...and no one I knew thought of HCTN as "edgy" especially since disco was a dying trend. In fact anything but disco would have been perceived as cooler in 79. If they had made a disco record in '75 that would have been edgy. This release was ridiculed, thought of as a pathetic joke and therefore it massively underperformed in relation to the promotion budget it was given. The BB's and CBS suddenly pretended HCTN didn't exist because of the backlash it received...booed at Radio City Music Hall. People I knew didn't hate it just because it was disco, there were plenty of disco records we adored...people hated it because it was a desperate and dated sounding record. Love You and POB had shown the BB's could still be edgy, and the hope was that progression might flower, things like Angel Come Home (which actually got airplay on KROQ) hinted at the possibility...but HCTN reeked of sell out. People didn't like the smell. It was an embarrassing moment to be a diehard BB's fan. I was there...I remember. It was a failure.

[urbanite]

HCTN was gimmicky, it didn't work for the Beach Boys, even though the original track was good.  Rod Stewart did a disco record at around the same time and it was a huge hit.

[TdHabib]

A most interesting interview all in all.