I feel for those who are going through something internally/mentally. It’s cliche, but I hope that one day we can all just enjoy this amazing music and not get caught up in the drama of it all (I’m 100% guilty of this). I think one day, when all the band has sadly passed, we’ll look back and realize how petty all this was/is.

Want to clarify one thing. I see someone on the EH forum has mentioned that SS is diametrically opposed to the opinions being shared on EH - and that it is “Howie the Hero vs Howie the villain”. Not berating the poster or calling them out (as I can see why some would view this situation this way). But I’d like to clear this up a little bit:

I think most here on SS who have commented on the set have also shared some misgivings about some of the mixes (including myself). I think many here (including myself) had questions/comments regarding Howie’s initial podcast interview (as some of us didn’t agree with everything Howie said).

So it’s not that we are diametrically opposed to the opinions being shared, it is that we aren't picking every last sentence of Howie’s interviews apart. We have concerns about some of the mixes on the SoS set but we also seem to be realistic about it (no boycotts or refusal to listen to sets, etc). We commented on his initial interview but had rational dialog about it and learned a bit about Howie’s perspective along the way.

I think there is a diametrical difference between the forums, but it’s nothing to do with opinion: it is how we express those opinions and observations. And at the core of that is the people expressing those opinions. And some people on EH have been cordial about their opinions. But it is clear that some have been nothing but overtly rude to Howie and the team about this set (and the FF set). And reason being: a lot of the people who were booted off of this forum for breaking rules all congregated there. So of course the mindset that got a lot of those people banned here is manifesting there - and this has become very apparent in the past few weeks.

Edit: and I want to add that people have lied about the bans that took place here (claiming that people were banned for their opinions), but as Billy said, never has anyone linked to or shared any evidence to back up their claims. People that were banned from here broke forum rules. Also want to add that not every person banned from here has acted rudely there in this situation. And not every person who has acted rudely there in this situation was banned from here.

Wow. It really sounds like a Brian Wilson composition/production. The vocals are amazing - as are the lyrics. They're just right.

Can't wait for the full album!! How is it coming along?

Not sure if the esq chat will happen if that board keeps celebrating stolen music…

I can't imagine any of the team (Howie, Mark, Alan, etc) wanting to step into such an onslaught of vitriol. For starters, one of the most vocal/harshest critics of the SoS set on that forum has gone on disturbing homophobic tirades in the past (doesn't sound like an environment I'd want to willingly place myself). Secondly, the forum's very own administrator treated Howie so disrespectfully when Howie was responding to the criticisms of his podcast interview...If the admin of their forum can't even act like a grown-up when interacting with a Beach Boys insider then they really shouldn't expect others on that forum to act any differently (and many have proven this point in recent weeks). Thirdly, they're still railing into Howie over there after his radio interview (and some are even trying to calm others down lest the Zoom meeting doesn't happen). I believe one person is claiming Howie said he didn't like the drums from the original Marcella - which I think is not at all what Howie was saying: He was saying that when he heard the new mix he wasn't too thrilled about the drums, but then he just decided to go along for the ride ("stop being a geek") and enjoy it for what it is: a mix that brings out a lot of elements that were buried before. Which is a perfectly logical standpoint. He's just being open and honest about how he looks at things.

And knocking Howie for not being able to hear the missing "s" - I mean, I find it odd too, but again, I don't have his ears. My father has hearing loss due to a war and going to a Chicago concert haha, he can't hear certain sounds anymore. That being said, I think there should be a more rigorous quality control element added onto the pre-release process for this very reason. But I'm also not going to knock a guy for not being able to hear something that is already very soft in the mix.

I mean people are just being relentless about anything to do with Howie and this set over there. It is mildly disturbing at this point. What's really odd to me is that I have seen some of these same posters twist themselves into pretzels to defend Mike Love's actions or comments toward/about Brian Wilson, and here Howie makes some harmless comments about his perspective and it's as if he invaded Poland.

This is where the ugly politics of all this stuff starts infecting the whole thing.

What I find most interesting are those who either deny or ignore that the politics are even at play right now. The "it's all about the music" line actually means "please ignore any obvious moves we're making to put ourselves in positions to help [____] camp out. Thanks."

It's so obvious, yet so many people just ignore it or are too entrenched to see it.

Ahhh man. That is really sad to hear.

Oddly enough I was watching clips of 'Dances With Wolves' over the weekend and almost watched the movie itself - had no idea that was him on the harmonica.

I thought it was a good interview.

I do find it odd that Howie can't hear the missing "s" in Good Vibrations, but heh, I don't have his ears so I can't judge. That being said, I really find it odd that it made it through the entire release process and no one commented on it (to me it is very noticeable). And that goes for other things in a few of the mixes.

Honestly I just can't see where people are coming from with the high-end compression complaints - and I'm not saying they're wrong in what they hear, but I just don't hear anything that makes me want to not listen to these mixes again...and to the degree that I've seen two instances (could be the same person) where there are calls for Mark to be fired from his job. I listened to some of the tracks that people found "unlistenable" on Feel Flows and the new set, and I just don't hear what the fuss is about. Thankfully I don't hear the over-compression stuff (or I do and my brain thinks it sounds good) and I'm overall very happy with the new mixes. There is something about the way Brian sings "well it's been building up inside of me for I don't know how long" - the way that "for" comes through in the new mix is worth every penny of this set. It's a gem that I just had never picked up on in previous mixes - it's definitely there in previous mixes, but his inflection on that part shines in this mix.

Anywho, thanks for the interview Howie, and thanks for making us aware of it, Guitarfool.

I’m hearing reports that Howie said “We’ve all heard the last of the psychedelic barbershop quartet.”

In all seriousness, looking forward to hearing the replay. I’m glad Howie hasn't bern deterred by some whining children on the web.

[America's Band]

I didn’t expect a big 60th tour for all the reasons we’ve gone over here countless times, but hoped (like Al did or does) that there would be a handful of shows or so. I’m a younger fan who wasn’t as into the band when C50 happened, so I’ve been hoping for my last chance to see at least four or five Beach Boys together on stage again. I’ve seen Brian and Al once (and I will again for a second time this year) and Mike and Bruce twice and enjoyed both shows but have constantly hoped for that chance to see them all together. Maybe it was a hopeless dream from the start, but it was my dream.

These are my exact sentiments as well. I knew another 50th would never happen (it was a miracle it happened the first time). But I was expecting something for the 60th. And while I know the Iconic acquisition was more about the catalog, I too was hoping it would spark some reconciliation between all parties.

It's just sad that a band that created the most wonderful music about love, warmth, and comfort, seems to embody polar opposite traits of that. And I'm not saying that every remaining member has solely negative traits. But it just seems that the band itself, the modern name of The Beach Boys is a brittle plastic shell of what it could be.

It's the 60th anniversary of America's Band and what is going on during July 4th weekend? Mike is duetting the "Drink em down down drink em down" song with LoCash in Nashville. The blame is probably scattered, but it is sad a hell nonetheless.

I don't even want to say that the fans deserve better - because this is the most childish music fandom I've ever come across (and I contribute my fair share of the petulance, but the infantile whining/fighting/finger-pointing is scattered all over the forums and social media). But at least for the sake of the future fans, for the sake of the music itself, hell for the country itself, these guys need to come together and do something special. This is a huge milestone, and it seems to just be going to waste - as every good opportunity does with this band.

Will a new thread be created for the newer release of Sounds of Summer? Or should the reviews go in the old SoS thread?

That's awesome.

It truly is something else that a bunch of kids from Hawthorne California are still making it up the charts after all these years. Of course the greatness of the music is why people keep listening, but a huge thanks to everyone who has had a hand in keeping this band's music going for all these years.

Seems some of us may not be familiar with the term, "hyperbole."

I mean, the first guy to respond to the comparison literally defined the term hyperbole in his opening line. So I don't think it's a matter of not being familiar with the term.

The original hyperbole coined by Mike just doesn't make any sense (as in, he's exaggerating the idea that anyone who loves Brian also hates Mike which just isn't true). And it seems that Lonely Summer riffed on that hyperbole for his own intentional exaggeration. And given the original isn't grounded in any sense of reality, it makes sense to me that anyone playing off this exaggeration is going to be met with some blowback from certain people who don't agree.

The original quote from Mike sums up perfectly the flawed way he looks at things (or perhaps used to look at things). Few can deny that Brian Wilson has something special going on when it comes to music - so already most people are going to put Brian on a pedestal above others (even very accomplished songwriters bow down to Brian’s genius in various ways). Secondly, plenty of people who feel that way also don’t give a hoot about Mike’s personality issues. Mike makes this weird exaggeration that automatically generalizes an entire group of BB fans, probably most of whom just don’t care about these petty Mike vs Brian issues to begin with.

I just find it to be a means of divisiveness that doesn’t need to exist. And while I get that he’s trying to point out just how much people dislike him, you also don’t need Brian Wilson there as a yin to your yang to make your point. As in, if I were to sue my cousin and his family over a harmless picture on a freebie CD, you wouldn’t need to know the stature of my cousin to know that I’m a fairly petty person. If I were to host a benefit dinner that was raising money to support the killing of endangered species, you wouldn’t need to know my cousin in order to know that I may not have the most solid moral foundation. If I were to invite someone on a plane ride and then at the end of the trip make him pay for the fuel, you wouldn’t need to know my cousin in order to know that I’m not that nice of a person. Etc etc.

That quote from Mike is cute for a book or the papers, but it doesn’t at all represent the reality of the way some people view Mike Love…the strict correlation between being in awe of Brian’s talent/music and how one feels about Mike Love just doesn’t exist. Hopefully he (or his apologists) doesn’t actually think this is true.

Thanks, Rocker!

Very cool they’re focusing heavily on their 70s output. Al even mentions how ‘All This Is That’ is remixed for the upcoming set…which (to me) implies that all the album songs will be remixed for the new set (considering All This Is That isn’t a remix on SoS, but it is on the upcoming set). Honestly if these songs are remixed the way Marcella/YNAMOH are on the SoS set I’ll be a very happy guy. I think the new Marcella mix is hands-down a better sounding mix.

Mike somehow manages to cram 6 references of how he wrote the lyrics to GV into a 6 sentence paragraph. The man is truly gifted with words.

Very glad Al gave the California Saga some love - a very underrated segment of their career that I hope more casual fans will come to appreciate!

Agreed about Amazon. Apple Music is usually my go-to. And it's basically just because I can easily upload any albums that aren't available on Apple Music (mostly Beach Boys bootlegs, and other rarity items from artists) and have them available on all my Apple devices. Spotify is hands-down the best for discovering new music, Apple Music is the best streaming service for music library management, imo.

But that being said, even if things are properly labeled, depending on the codec, depending on the means of listening, depending on the EQ settings, any kind of music is going to sound different from service to service. That's just the nature of having many different ways to listen to music these days. And sadly sometimes it also means streaming services will get lazy and mis-label things (very annoying when that happens, though it's been kinda rare for me to encounter that recently).

@Billy, that sucks. I don’t know the full context, but VDPs has definitely been more edgy in recent years. Perhaps like the rest of us, the internet has made him more cynical.

Honestly, even with his recent idiosyncrasies, I don’t mind the guy. He has always followed the beat of his own drum, which is very admirable. His Song Cycle album is fascinating to hear through the lens of its inspiration from the Smile Sessions. I love the Esso Steel Trinidad Band album (and accompanying documentary). And Discover America will always be one of my favorite albums from the 70s.

I do hope I didn’t come off too harshly and my reasoning came across fine.

And apparently according to the usual suspects I ripped him a new one, even though most of it wasn’t even directed to him (or at EH either, which again I said). But hey since this is being monitored, maybe someone can take the initiative and answer the question….

When one implies or straight up says that Brian is being controlled to the point he is forced to tour at 80 years old, that's gonna piss some people off. And I get that Awesoman explained his comment (even though I still just don't agree with his point of view), but you can't make a blanket statement that implies a lot of awful sh*t about the loving people surrounding Brian and expect a courteous reply. So if it's "rough stuff", perhaps more of that loving attitude they showed Howie Edelson should be shared here.

This forum has dealt with these inane conspiracy theories for a stupid long time, so it gets tiresome when people say things that imply (or straight up align with the idea) that Brian has no free will to retire.

Well I put it here because the post originated there. This isn’t really about an SS vs EH, more about a potential Zoom call with the team that gave us this great set.

And I put it in this thread so people who don’t want to read about the EH forum don’t have to click on the thread.

This does have to do with the new SoS comp, but it also veers into slightly off-topic territory. This was the first thread I found relating to the EH forum here so I thought it was more appropriate to put here rather than gum up the SoS thread.

Per the EH forum, David Beard may attempt to set up a Zoom call for fans to discuss the SoS comp, and he’s going to invite the team (Mark, Alan, Howie, perhaps others) for them to hear from the fans. Just wanted to let people here know in case there was interest.

There have been some complaints about the project, but everyone has been mature and respectful to all who had a hand in the making of the set, so I can’t see any problematic issues arising with this. Given that Howie’s PR outreach with the podcast interview seemed to resonate well with fans, I think this Zoom call could be another great way for fans to show their respect to the guy. And since Mark’s recent mixes have been nothing but praised by certain fans, this just gives another way for those fans to express their appreciation of his efforts. Sounds like a real nice way for this wonderful fanbase to interact with a team they clearly respect.

Props to David Beard for taking the lead on this, thankfully someone like him is there with absolutely no agenda and just wants us all to come together for the sake of the music. Really awesome. Thanks David for being awesome like that.

PS, I really hope there is some moderation regarding foul language. I have a pet goldfish who has never heard a swear word in his life and I’d hate for him to be exposed to foul language and traumatize him. I also don’t allow him to glance at my MOJO mags with interviews with Mike Love because of this very reason. Thanks.

VDP's bitterness has turned me off his music quite a bit in recent years, apart from the Smile stuff and Orange Crate Art - too bad really.

Not trying to hijack Brian’s birthday thread, but prior to my own negative experience with VDP, I already wasn’t really a fan aside from those two projects and the melody of the song later remade for TLOS

Billy, if you don’t mind my asking, what was your negative experience with VDP?

Great posts, Join the Human Race and Tony S.

I saw Brian in 2020 right before the pandemic shut everything down. Brian looks older every time I see him, he doesn’t hit every note perfectly. But I remember him being upbeat, and of course his band was just stellar. The way I see it: I don’t go to see Brian at his peak. I go because:

- Brian still gives us a little magic in his performances - may not be every song, it may be only one song, but it’s worth it.
- because I don’t know if I’ll get another chance to see him. Something I’ve learned in life: it is hard to watch people decline as they get older, but those moments you spend with them in those years are moments you will cherish and are glad you had.
- because I’m in the same room as my musical hero. To me, it’s like being in the same room as Beethoven.
- because it is the most joyous thing to be apart of the standing ovation after GOK ends.
- because I get to see some of the most talented musicians/bands work their magic. I think all of us musicians who ever dreamed of making it big in a band see Darian as an absolute hero, and we’re all jealous of the talent he and his bandmates have.

I totally understand if people think seeing Brian is too depressing. So I’d never try to convince anyone they need to keep going to his shows. But those are just some of the reasons why I continue to go see him.

If I thought for one second that Brian was intentionally or unintentionally being pushed too far by his management/handlers/wife/band/etc I wouldn’t support his touring. But I think Brian is just a complicated guy who seems to like being on the road these days for whatever reason. He may seem sad at times, or detached, but the guy has schizo-affective disorder and a slew of other mental health issues - I can’t imagine what he goes through internally at times. But being surrounded by friends, being surrounded by music is probably better therapy than being parked in front of a TV alone at home. For that reason alone I’ll keep supporting the guy when I can.

I have faith that if Brian were being pushed in a direction that was impacting his overall happiness and health, that the good people who have been around Brian for the last 20+ years would have the human decency to stand up for him (if Brian really was in a situation that he could not have the final say in)...including his daughters and close friends.

You simply wrote "if his handlers allowed him to retire".

No other entertainer ever (outside of some Landy-esque sociopathic control) has handlers who wouldn't allow them to retire. I'm merely replying to what you said. Your usage of the term "handler" became derogatory when you claimed that they are impeding his ability to make a very important life choice. Again, if you can't see this, so be it.

And some comments on social media doesn't prove anything. It is ONE moment/snapshot from Brian's birthday - talk about reading too deeply into things. Goodness gracious.

I'm not reading into anything deeply. You straight up claimed that Brian has handlers that don't allow him to do a certain thing (retire)....that just flat out implies certain things. If you can't see that then so be it.

And as for forum "rivalry", that implies some competition or superiority. I am not claiming one thing or another about us winning or dominating anything, just stating a fact that a lot of prominent posters there have claimed Melinda is controlling, have claimed that Brian is controlled by handlers, etc, and that such talk would seem to belong there since many* (edited out "most" as I have no idea how many people there actually believe this nonsense) people there agree with this claim of Brian not being able to retire due to his "handlers".

In all honesty if his handlers allowed him to retire

You realize everything that this implies? It implies that Brian isn't allowed to make big decisions in his life. It implies that if Brian is being forced against his will that every person in Brian's life (from Darian, to Al, to Brian's own children and good long-time friends, to his wife) don't stand up and speak out on his behalf...that they are ignoring what seems to be obvious to armchair quarterbacks watching YouTube clips, but they themselves are either clueless, or in on it, or are spineless.

So yeah, if I sound pissed I'm just tired of reading these claims that imply a lot of awful things about the great people in Brian's life.

If Brian didn't want to do any of this he would refuse to get out of bed. He would tell his doctors. He would tell his friends. But guess what, his friends all say he wants to be out on the road. But yet for some reason people on the internet don't believe that and keep fueling these silly theories that Brian has no control over his own life.

As for the ridiculousness of the board feuds....most of the people who claim that Brian is controlled, most of the people with an ax to grind with Melinda are on that forum, most people with a history of talking sh*t about Melinda or Brian's life are on that forum. Which is why I say that this sh*t belongs there. Has nothing to do with forum "rivalry".