New Beach Boys release will make you 'SMiLE'

[Andrew G. Doe]

why is philcohen taking this so personal

We (meaning Beach Boys fans) should all be taking this personal.

But to slightly change the direction of this discussion, I should note, Brian, Mike, Bruce & Al are all at(or within a year of) 70 years old. Since I'm 16 years younger than they are, I'll likely outlive them and I'll be here to see a posthumous release of "Smile", if there is still a Capitol Records(or a record industry at all) to release it. But this Gang of Four should consider the advantages of releasing the material within their lifetimes: they'll be able to have input into the mixing, mastering, sequencing, liner notes & packaging. But they'll have no input whatsoever if "Smile" has to become a posthumous project released after they're all gone. Some posthumous compiler might decide to re-edit or tamper with the musical content or record new instrumental tracks, just like the dreaded producer Alan Douglas did on the Jimi Hendrix "Crash Landing" & "Midnight Lightning" albums, under the premise that he is "completing the recordings as the artist would have".

OK, promise this is the last time (until, uh, the next time of course):

Phil, the only person to have even hinted that what Alan initially announced may not come to pass is... Alan. Who last time I looked, didn't work for Capitol Records. No-one else directly involved has said anything. To quote the great Basil Fawlty, please try to understand this before one of us dies.

As for "they'll be able to have input into the mixing, mastering, sequencing, liner notes & packaging", except for the last two items (which I grant are potential minefields), only one person needs to be considered and he'll probably listen to the test discs once and go "fine".

[The Shift]

why is philcohen taking this so personal

We (meaning Beach Boys fans) should all be taking this personal.

But to slightly change the direction of this discussion, I should note, Brian, Mike, Bruce & Al are all at(or within a year of) 70 years old. Since I'm 16 years younger than they are, I'll likely outlive them and I'll be here to see a posthumous release of "Smile", if there is still a Capitol Records(or a record industry at all) to release it. But this Gang of Four should consider the advantages of releasing the material within their lifetimes: they'll be able to have input into the mixing, mastering, sequencing, liner notes & packaging. But they'll have no input whatsoever if "Smile" has to become a posthumous project released after they're all gone. Some posthumous compiler might decide to re-edit or tamper with the musical content or record new instrumental tracks, just like the dreaded producer Alan Douglas did on the Jimi Hendrix "Crash Landing" & "Midnight Lightning" albums, under the premise that he is "completing the recordings as the artist would have".

OK, promise this is the last time (until, uh, the next time of course):

Phil, the only person to have even hinted that what Alan initially announced may not come to pass is... Alan. Who last time I looked, didn't work for Capitol Records. No-one else directly involved has said anything. To quote the great Basil Fawlty, please try to understand this before one of us dies.

As for "they'll be able to have input into the mixing, mastering, sequencing, liner notes & packaging", except for the last two items (which I grant are potential minefields), only one person needs to be considered and he'll probably listen to the test discs once and go "fine".

Blatantly inaccurate and I expect better Andrew.

He'll listen once and go "my wife says 'fine'".

They probably already did.

[Andrew G. Doe]

why is philcohen taking this so personal

We (meaning Beach Boys fans) should all be taking this personal.

But to slightly change the direction of this discussion, I should note, Brian, Mike, Bruce & Al are all at(or within a year of) 70 years old. Since I'm 16 years younger than they are, I'll likely outlive them and I'll be here to see a posthumous release of "Smile", if there is still a Capitol Records(or a record industry at all) to release it. But this Gang of Four should consider the advantages of releasing the material within their lifetimes: they'll be able to have input into the mixing, mastering, sequencing, liner notes & packaging. But they'll have no input whatsoever if "Smile" has to become a posthumous project released after they're all gone. Some posthumous compiler might decide to re-edit or tamper with the musical content or record new instrumental tracks, just like the dreaded producer Alan Douglas did on the Jimi Hendrix "Crash Landing" & "Midnight Lightning" albums, under the premise that he is "completing the recordings as the artist would have".

OK, promise this is the last time (until, uh, the next time of course):

Phil, the only person to have even hinted that what Alan initially announced may not come to pass is... Alan. Who last time I looked, didn't work for Capitol Records. No-one else directly involved has said anything. To quote the great Basil Fawlty, please try to understand this before one of us dies.

As for "they'll be able to have input into the mixing, mastering, sequencing, liner notes & packaging", except for the last two items (which I grant are potential minefields), only one person needs to be considered and he'll probably listen to the test discs once and go "fine".

Blatantly inaccurate and I expect better Andrew.

He'll listen once and go "my wife says 'fine'".

They probably already did.

Also wrong - it'll be "my wifeandmanagers say "fine"".

[Roger Ryan]

Also, what is "Classic Albums?" (In March.)

I guess all of the Beach Boys "classic" albums can fit on 2 CDs...once you remove the filler

[The Heartical Don]

Also, what is "Classic Albums?" (In March.)

I guess all of the Beach Boys "classic" albums can fit on 2 CDs...once you remove the filler

  mean but funny...

[drbeachboy]

I do not go to Brian's board at all, and so I ask: Has his people flatly denied Al's comments? In the past, they have been very quick to kill rumors and get their side out. This release lives or dies mostly with Brian and what his "wifeandmanagers" say.

[bgas]

This release lives or dies mostly with Brian and what his "wifeandmanagers" say.

Well, that, and Mike's lawyers.

[LostArt]

I do not go to Brian's board at all, and so I ask: Has his people flatly denied Al's comments? In the past, they have been very quick to kill rumors and get their side out. This release lives or dies mostly with Brian and what his "wifeandmanagers" say.

As AGD said, no one has denied what Alan said in his first comment, except Alan.  In that comment, he said that Brian has agreed to release the stuff.  In his retraction, he did not say anything about Brian changing his mind.  When asked, Capitol Records were not comfortable giving any information.  None of the other Beach Boys have said anything.  Neither Alan Boyd nor Mark Linett have denied anything.  I would say that if there was not going to be a release of the Smile stuff, one of the principals would have come out and said 'nope...not happening'.  No reason to be 'hush hush' if nothing's in the works.

[drbeachboy]

I totally agree with you there. If this Smile release was really down for the count, I'm sure Brian's people would have put out a statement saying so.

Phil, hang in there, baby. All is not lost, yet.

[The Shift]

I do not go to Brian's board at all, and so I ask: Has his people flatly denied Al's comments? In the past, they have been very quick to kill rumors and get their side out. This release lives or dies mostly with Brian and what his "wifeandmanagers" say.

As AGD said, no one has denied what Alan said in his first comment, except Alan.  In that comment, he said that Brian has agreed to release the stuff.  In his retraction, he did not say anything about Brian changing his mind.  When asked, Capitol Records were not comfortable giving any information.  None of the other Beach Boys have said anything.  Neither Alan Boyd nor Mark Linett have denied anything.  I would say that if there was not going to be a release of the Smile stuff, one of the principals would have come out and said 'nope...not happening'.  No reason to be 'hush hush' if nothing's in the works.

Y'right. Remember how Mike was dragged by his hair to a keyboard to retract his own 50th anniversary tale via BW's site, last year?

That ain't happened this time. There's still time I guess, but it ain't happened yet.  And with BW haviong presented BWPS 7 years ago, this has to be closer to his radar. But he's not instructed any denial.

I remain positive.

[The Heartical Don]

 I wonder whether Brian would be worried over a SMiLE '67 set this year. Given that he gave the world his own completed version in 2004, to great acclaim, toured the thing, and went on to other projects, and given that SMiLE '67 wasn't finished and will never be, it seems to me that it's simply not in his nature to feel some sort of negative vibe, a competitive spirit, or even jealousy about the matter. And moreover, SMiLE '67 was his baby too, he's all over the place, so where's the objection?

I concur with AGD: his verdict on a well-compiled 'old' SMiLE would simply be: 'fine'.

[sparkydog1725]

This is a great thread, whether the damn thing gets an official release or not. Andrew G. Doe and Phil Cohen are very entertaining, opinionated, and informed gentlemen, and the great thing is they are debating a lot of points without attacking each other, regardless of comments from the peanut gallery trying to inflame the discussion. The Hoffman forums are much worse for losing Phil, as well as the defection of a few others who have had enough of Steve's nonsense, but it is still a great place to discuss pertinent topics such as "I want some BIG JOHN'S BEANS 'N' FIXIN'S. Where are they?", "Would The Beatles have stayed together had World War III broken out in 1968?" or "What's the temperature right now where you live? (Part 4)". 

By the way, seventeen potential buyers of this release died while I was typing this. Hurry up, Capitol.

[Jonas]

and the great thing is they are debating a lot of points without attacking each other

Won't be long!

[PhilCohen]

This is a great thread, whether the damn thing gets an official release or not. Andrew G. Doe and Phil Cohen are very entertaining, opinionated, and informed gentlemen, and the great thing is they are debating a lot of points without attacking each other, regardless of comments from the peanut gallery trying to inflame the discussion. The Hoffman forums are much worse for losing Phil, as well as the defection of a few others who have had enough of Steve's nonsense, but it is still a great place to discuss pertinent topics such as "I want some BIG JOHN'S BEANS 'N' FIXIN'S. Where are they?", "Would The Beatles have stayed together had World War III broken out in 1968?" or "What's the temperature right now where you live? (Part 4)". 

By the way, seventeen potential buyers of this release died while I was typing this. Hurry up, Capitol.

I doubt that Andrew & myself are going start attacking each other. It's not my "bag", though we disagree on the definition of the word "Mix"(noun). A carefully crafted  finished/polished mix by Mark Linett(or Stephen Desper or the late Chuck Britz) is a mix, but so is a clandestine one-pass-of-the tape mix from the multitracks(such as the mixes supplied to unofficial label "Sea of Tunes"). In either event, what we're talking about is someone mixing down a 3-track/half inch , 4-track/half inch or 8-track/one inch session multitrack tape to produce a stereo or mono result. A mix is a mix, whether an engineer has the luxury of spending hours on it, or whether the mix must be made quickly in 3 minutes, adjusting the mix "On The Fly".

[Mikie]

Phil, hang in there, baby. All is not lost, yet.

Yeah, Phil, Al is not lost yet.....

[PhilCohen]

Phil, hang in there, baby. All is not lost, yet.

Yeah, Phil, Al is not lost yet.....

Al may not be lost, but All is lost

[Runaways]

[pixletwin]

Phil, hang in there, baby. All is not lost, yet.

Yeah, Phil, Al is not lost yet.....

Al may not be lost, but All is lost

What is it exactly that drives you to feel the need to exact your opinion as more than just opinion?

[sockittome]

WAH_WAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH!!!!!

[PhilCohen]

Phil, hang in there, baby. All is not lost, yet.

Yeah, Phil, Al is not lost yet.....

Al may not be lost, but All is lost

What is it exactly that drives you to feel the need to exact your opinion as more than just opinion?

It was a joke about a typographical error. Obviously the person who posted it accidentally typed "Al" instead of "All".
And, by the way, just who is this "Debbie Downer"? One time, on the Steve Hoffman forums, I was compared to Ms.Downer, and someone posted a photo of her. As for the context in which I was previously compared to Ms. Downer, it was a long-ongoing thread concerning whether Neil Young would ever permit his "Archives Vol.1" box set to be released, after more than ten years of teasing his fans about it, and more than a half dozen cancelled release dates.

[sockittome]

Debbie Downer was a character in a recurring SNL skit some years ago.  She would be at a party or family dinner, and every time someone would bring up a positive or exciting subject, Debbie would respond with a downer comment.  This was punctuated by the camera zooming in on her smirking expression and a trombone blast...WAH-WAAAAAAHHHH!

[Ron]

QUOTING

Thank you for straightening THAT out. 

[Mikie]

[It was a joke about a typographical error. Obviously the person who posted it accidentally typed "Al" instead of "All".

That wasn't an accident, Phil.  The "typographical error" was mine and was intentional. And it was a joke.   

[18thofMay]

This guy I know confirmed to me a few weeks back that Capitol were indeed releasing "the Smile fragments". "This guy" really should be on the money, he has been practically/literally begging Capitol to do so since the early eighties!

[Seaside Woman]

This guy I know confirmed to me a few weeks back that Capitol were indeed releasing "the Smile fragments". "This guy" really should be on the money, he has been practically/literally begging Capitol to do so since the early eighties!

Thankee kindly, that's just the kind of thing I like to read/hear!