MiC up for order on Amazon, August release

[Andrew G. Doe]

Fair enough.  Courtesy of AGD, I counted 48 of the 50 tracks found on 50 Big Ones are included in MIC.  I think that was part of my point.

Nothing of the sort - your actual words were "but 2/3 of it is 50 Big Ones", which is, demonstrably, utter and complete nonsense, not to mention piss-poor math on your part. 48 out of 174 is just over 27.5% - some considerable way short of 66.67%.

Nope, you're wrong.  What I said was far more correct than that.  It wasn't complete and utter nonsense.  Wanna know why?

I meant "50 Big Ones" in terms of "type of content" -- greatest hits -- not the literal tracklist of 50 Big Ones.  YET.. the fact that nearly 30% of this is ACTUALLY 50 Big Ones, is more than I thought.

Piss-poor my azz.

Ah, so now you're backpeddaling by saying you didn't actually mean the 50BO release, but in a generic "greatest hits" manner. So suddenly we're supposed to be psychic and understand what you really meant. If you'd said "2/3 of it is hits", then I'd be more inclined to cut you a bit of slack.

Except that even that's not right - by my count there are 44 tracks that made on the Billboard Hot 100 singles chart 1962-1988, and rusty as my math is, 44 out of 170-odd is not 66.67%. More like 25%. Not two-thirds, but one-quarter. Like I said, piss-poor math.  Bottom line - you use numbers to support or make a point, good idea to make sure they add up the way you say they do. Gives the impression you actually do know WTF you're talking about.

[monicker]

That said, I'm in a minority in that I don't think much of Summer's Gone at all. I think nearly all of its power comes from context and its placement at the end of what will almost certainly be the band's last album. As a song, it's frankly mediocre.

I couldn't disagree more. It's nowhere near mediocre. It has a beautiful arrangement, to me (IMHO) way more beautiful than FTTBA. Its quality has nothing to do with context or placement. But then, I'm in the minority in that FTTBA moves me very little, and feeling it has a dire arrangement, go figure that.

Me too. I love SG and find FTTBA unlistenable. I'll give you that it's ambitious and interesting, but it does nothing for me, on top of being unpleasant to listen to.
Opinions 

[Bean Bag]

Fair enough.  Courtesy of AGD, I counted 48 of the 50 tracks found on 50 Big Ones are included in MIC.  I think that was part of my point.

Nothing of the sort - your actual words were "but 2/3 of it is 50 Big Ones", which is, demonstrably, utter and complete nonsense, not to mention piss-poor math on your part. 48 out of 174 is just over 27.5% - some considerable way short of 66.67%.

Nope, you're wrong.  What I said was far more correct than that.  It wasn't complete and utter nonsense.  Wanna know why?

I meant "50 Big Ones" in terms of "type of content" -- greatest hits -- not the literal tracklist of 50 Big Ones.  YET.. the fact that nearly 30% of this is ACTUALLY 50 Big Ones, is more than I thought.

Piss-poor my azz.

You are pushing it on your explanation. I doubt anyone took what you posted the same way as your explanation. I know that I surely didn't. Either way, no big whoop.

2/3 of this is [just like] 50 Big Ones... was my point.

Obviously it couldn't be 2/3 verbatim.  50 Big Ones is only 2 discs.  This is 6.  I thought that would have been obvious.  However, the fact that 1/3 of MIC is actually 50 Big Ones verbatim is more than I even thought.

For the Math Police -- Yes, I know... it's reeeeallly only 48 of 50 Big Ones. 


So... for the Math nazis...
$145 - $25 (50 Big Ones) = $120 for a 4 disc box set.  That's the point.  I know the price may go down -- but that's still crazy to me.  Had I bought 50 Big Ones (and I almost did on several occasions) I'd be angry.

[Bean Bag]

Ah, so now you're backpeddaling by saying you didn't actually mean the 50BO release, but in a generic "greatest hits" manner. So suddenly we're supposed to be psychic and understand what you really meant. If you'd said "2/3 of it is hits", then I'd be more inclined to cut you a bit of slack.

Except that even that's not right - by my count there are 44 tracks that made on the Billboard Hot 100 singles chart 1962-1988, and rusty as my math is, 44 out of 170-odd is not 66.67%. More like 25%. Not two-thirds, but one-quarter. Like I said, piss-poor math.  Bottom line - you use numbers to support or make a point, good idea to make sure they add up the way you say they do. Gives the impression you actually do know WTF you're talking about.

Back-peddling?  Hardly!  Doubling down.  Clarifying.  Standing up for the little guy!!

And you're doing it again... with the term 'greatest hits!'  I don't mean top 40, top 10.  Geez... I'm just saying (golly what do I call it) the normal compilation stuff.  No, that's no good either.

1/3 is 50 Big ones.
1/3 of this would be 50 Big Ones, Part 2

The last 1/3 -- and maybe it's 38.689876%  (okay... I don't care!) -- is the stuff we'll be talking about once you agree with me and admit that we're paying A LOT of money for 2 (two and 1/2) discs.   

 

[Generation42]

Is "Goin' to the Beach" supposed to be any good?

If you're interested, there's a version a fan made by putting together the backing track with demo vocals.  It's not a perfect job, certainly, but if nothing else, it offers a sense of what me might expect of a more fully-realized version.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC6DfsQo1RE

Now, if you'd rather be surprised when MiC hits, don't bother.  Personally, I think the song has some promise.  It's certainly not the sonic abortion some would have us believe, anyway.

[AndrewHickey]

I have to say though the inclusions from other band members were the touches that I really enjoyed. Following the intermission with "Pet Sounds" then "Add some Music", ending the show with "Summer's Gone" really made the show for me.

I've always said Mike and Bruce have a great set list, I'm amazed that they played "You still believe in me" that's incredible, but I stand by my point that it's a good thing the setlist was a group effort and not just Mike, his obvious inclusions like Rock n Roll music , Betsy, It's Ok among others were some of the lowlights of the show I was at.

Who says Pet Sounds was another band member's idea?
As for Rock & Roll Music and It's OK, both would almost certainly have been included no matter who drew up the setlist, given that they were both hits. And you're definitely in a minority when it comes to Betsy -- pretty much everyone else seems to have loved that one.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Had I bought 50 Big Ones (and I almost did on several occasions) I'd be angry.

I bought 50BO, and I'll buy MiC, because... because I'm a fan. It's what I do. I'm more pissed at the live album, not because I have 94.7609783% of the tracks somewhere else in a live format, but because the sound sucks, and royally at that.

As I see it, you're complaining that the box is essentially a retread of 50BO... a release you didn't actually buy. So... your point is... what exactly ? Don't be outraged on my behalf, please. I reserve my ire for people who are trying to make a point without actually knowing what kind of point they're supposed to be making, with insufficiently understood data. Ever thought of a career in politics ? 

[Mike's Beard]

I'm really surprised that Summer's Gone isn't on MIC. (Maybe Mike vetoed it? )

And as for Mike vetoing Summer's Gone (and I know you're joking, but other people have said similar things seriously), I've heard from two independent, trustworthy sources that Mike didn't veto a single track. Apparently he had some concerns about the packaging and presentation, but none with any of the music.

This should be sticky on the front page.

Where has this myth that Mike vetos tracks left, right and centre come from exactly?

[AndrewHickey]

And you're doing it again... with the term 'greatest hits!'  I don't mean top 40, top 10.  Geez... I'm just saying (golly what do I call it) the normal compilation stuff.  No, that's no good either.

1/3 is 50 Big ones.
1/3 of this would be 50 Big Ones, Part 2

Ah, so what you mean by "Fifty Big Ones" is "Greatest Hits", and what you mean by "Greatest Hits" is "anything at all that was ever previously released".

Personally, I use the phrase "Greatest Hits" in a way that includes stuff that was a hit, not Sail Plane Song, We're Together Again, Soulful Old Man Sunshine, Fallin' In Love, Solar System or Surfers Rule...

Also, your original comment was:

t 2/3 of it is 50 Big Ones -- and not really a "Volume 2" of 50 Big Ones either.  It's the same thing, largely.

So by "greatest hits" you mean "stuff that was released on a rarities compilation once", by two-thirds you mean less than a third, and by 'not really a "Volume 2" of 50 Big Ones' you mean '50 Big Ones, Part 2;.

I see. That is definitely the intuitive, normal, logical way that everyone would read your comment, and not just something you've made up to save face.

The last 1/3 -- and maybe it's 38.689876%  (okay... I don't care!) -- is the stuff we'll be talking about once you agree with me and admit that we're paying A LOT of money for 2 (two and 1/2) discs.   

 

Well, I won't, and I suspect most other people here won't -- we'll be paying a lot of money for six discs. And as for you, you said the other day "Unless the price gets cut in half... It's not for me.  Not right now.  Maybe I'll get swept up in August.  Let's start the bidding at $55.00"

So no, "we" won't be paying a lot of money for two and a half discs, because you're not buying it and those of us who are are buying six discs, not two and a half.

[Iron Horse-Apples]

So the real question is, is your boxed set half price or half empty?

[Freddie French-Pounce]

Had I bought 50 Big Ones (and I almost did on several occasions) I'd be angry.

I bought 50BO, and I'll buy MiC, because... because I'm a fan. It's what I do. I'm more pissed at the live album, not because I have 94.7609783% of the tracks somewhere else in a live format, but because the sound sucks, and royally at that.

Exactly my view here. No-one is forcing you to buy anything, but they will tantalise you with it.

[Jeff]

Ah, so now you're backpeddaling by saying you didn't actually mean the 50BO release, but in a generic "greatest hits" manner. So suddenly we're supposed to be psychic and understand what you really meant. If you'd said "2/3 of it is hits", then I'd be more inclined to cut you a bit of slack.

Except that even that's not right - by my count there are 44 tracks that made on the Billboard Hot 100 singles chart 1962-1988, and rusty as my math is, 44 out of 170-odd is not 66.67%. More like 25%. Not two-thirds, but one-quarter. Like I said, piss-poor math.  Bottom line - you use numbers to support or make a point, good idea to make sure they add up the way you say they do. Gives the impression you actually do know WTF you're talking about.

Back-peddling?  Hardly!  Doubling down.  Clarifying.  Standing up for the little guy!!

And you're doing it again... with the term 'greatest hits!'  I don't mean top 40, top 10.  Geez... I'm just saying (golly what do I call it) the normal compilation stuff.  No, that's no good either.

1/3 is 50 Big ones.
1/3 of this would be 50 Big Ones, Part 2

The last 1/3 -- and maybe it's 38.689876%  (okay... I don't care!) -- is the stuff we'll be talking about once you agree with me and admit that we're paying A LOT of money for 2 (two and 1/2) discs.   

 

This is just painful.  

It's essentially the guy from Swingers who leaves a tongue tied vm on a girl's machine, then calls back to try to explain himself, but keeps making it worse and worse with every message.

Really bud, you're better off just backing away and cutting your losses.

[Jason]

I'm really surprised that Summer's Gone isn't on MIC. (Maybe Mike vetoed it? )

And as for Mike vetoing Summer's Gone (and I know you're joking, but other people have said similar things seriously), I've heard from two independent, trustworthy sources that Mike didn't veto a single track. Apparently he had some concerns about the packaging and presentation, but none with any of the music.

This should be sticky on the front page.

Where has this myth that Mike vetos tracks left, right and centre come from exactly?

Probably some low-IQ individual on the blueboard...

[coco1997]

SWD played me the completed track & bvs back in 1985 - it's catchy.

Excellent. Thanks for the info.

[Mark H]

I'd love for a rarities only set of course and my biggest disappointment is the lack of Adult Child stuff on the set.

However, echoing AGD above, I buy Beach Boys stuff as a fan. 

The Smile tracks were a big pull for the Good Vibrations box set (was it really 20 years ago?!) but even then I did second guess myself making that purchase as I already had most of the tracks.

I like material stuff so whilst it is an option (and cheaper) to get the unreleased tracks as downloads I'll be buying mine to look through and admire 'cos I'm a sucker for product! 

[Nicko1234]

I genuinely think that the cries of 'rip-off' from one or two board members are fair enough if that's how people feel. Every band has fans who complain about new reissues and including not enough rarities along with the already available stuff. It's certainly not limited to Beach Boys fans.

It's nothing new either as AGD commented in his book about the 3 reissues of BW Live at the Roxy and the, 'widespread, and seemingly valid, accusations of cynically sponging Wilson fanatics'.

There are obviously a far greater number of unreleased songs being included on MiC but the principal is the same.

[AndrewHickey]

And, to do an AGD as it were, here are the tracks for which I, at least, don't have a legal copy. The last compilation I got was Sounds Of Summer (and that was because I could get a copy with a free T-shirt), I don't have all the reissues (though I've got a few) so I don't have a lot of the stereo mixes, and I haven't bought any post-box-set re-re-reissues of Pet Sounds.

Here I *am* counting alternative mixes and edits, because they're often worth having.

So:

CD 1
----
1.    Home Recordings / "Surfin'" Rehearsal Highlights (2012 Edit - Mono)
4.    Surfin' Safari (Original Mono Long Version)
5.    409 (Original Mono Long Version)
13.   Surfers Rule (with Session Intro)
21.   Don't Worry Baby (2009 Stereo Mix)
22.   Why Do Fools Fall In Love (2009 Stereo Mix)
24.   I Get Around (with Session Intro - Mono)
25.   Wendy (2007 Stereo Mix)
26.   All Summer Long (2007 Stereo Mix)
29.   When I Grow Up (To Be A Man) (2012 Stereo Mix)
31.   Please Let Me Wonder (2007 Stereo Mix)
32.   Kiss Me, Baby (2000 Stereo Mix) -- is this the same as the mix on Endless Harmony (which I have) or something else?

 
CD 2
----
4.    Amusement Parks USA (Early Version)
7.    Graduation Day (Session Excerpt and Master Take, 2012 Mix)
11.   Radio Spot "Wonderful KYA" (Mono)
13.   Wouldn't It Be Nice (2001 Stereo Mix)
27.   Country Air (2012 Stereo Mix)
28.   Wild Honey (2012 Stereo Mix)
 
 
 
CD 3
----
1.    Darlin' (2012 Stereo Mix)
3.    Meant For You (Alternate Version)
7.    Sail Plane Song (2012 Stereo Mix)
8.    We're Together Again (2012 Stereo Mix)
10.   Do It Again (2012 Stereo Mix)
11.   Old Man River (Vocal Section)
16.   Can't Wait Too Long (A Cappella) -- if this isn't the version on Hawthorne
17.   Break Away (Alternate Version) -- if this isn't the version on Hawthorne
20.   Susie Cincinnati (2012 Mix)
28.   Fallin' In Love (2009 Stereo Mix)
29.   Sound Of Free (Mono Single Version)

 
CD 4
----
4.    (Wouldn't It Be Nice To) Live Again
10.   Rock And Roll Music (2012 Mix w/Extra Verse)
11.   It's OK (Alternate Mix)
17.   It's Over Now (Alternate Mix)
19.   California Feelin'
20.   Brian's Back (Alternate Mix)
24.   It's A Beautiful Day (Single Edit) (2012 Mix)
25.   Goin' To The Beach
 
 
 
CD 5
----
2.     Why Don't They Let Us Fall In Love
3.     Da Doo Ron Ron
7.     Soul Searchin'
8.     You're Still A Mystery
10.    Isn't It Time (Single Version)
 THE BEACH BOYS LIVE:
-------------------------------------------------------------
11.    Runaway (Chicago 1965 -- w/Concert Promo Intro - Mono)
12.    You're So Good To Me (Paris 1966 - Mono)
13.    The Letter (Hawaii Rehearsal 1967)
14.    Friends (Chicago 1968 - Mono)
15.    Little Bird (Chicago 1968 - Mono)
16.    All I Want To Do (London 1968)
17.    Help Me, Rhonda (New Jersey 1972)
18.    Wild Honey (New Jersey 1972)
19.    Only With You (New York 1972)
20.    It's About Time (Chicago 1973)
21.    I Can Hear Music (Maryland 1975)
22.    Vegetables (New York 1993)
23.    Wonderful (New York 1993)
24.    Sail On Sailor (Louisville 1995)
25.    Summer In Paradise (Wembley 1993)
 
 
 
CD 6
----
FROM THE VAULTS:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
1.     Radio Spot (1966 -- Mono)
2.     Slip On Through (A Cappella Mix)
3.     Don't Worry Baby (Stereo Session Outtake w/ Alternate Lead Vocal)
4.     Pom Pom Play Girl (Vocal Session Highlight)
5.     Guess I'm Dumb (Instrumental Track w/Background Vocals)
6.     Sherry She Needs Me (1965 Track w/1976 Vocal)
7.     Mona Kana (Instrumental Track)
8.     This Whole World (A Cappella)
9.     Where Is She?
10.    Had To Phone Ya (Instrumental Track)
13.    Be With Me (Demo)
14.    I Believe In Miracles (Vocal Section)
15.    Why (Instrumental Track)
16.    Barnyard Blues
17.    Don't Go Near The Water (Instrumental Track)
18.    You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling
19.    Transcendental Meditation (Instrumental Track)
20.    Our Sweet Love (Vocals w/Strings)
21.    Back Home (1970 Version)
22.    California Feelin' (Original Demo)
23.    California Girls ("Lei'd In Hawaii" Studio Version)
24.    Help You, Rhonda ("Lei'd In Hawaii" Studio Version)
26.    My Love Lives On
27.    Radio Spot (1964 - Mono)
28.    Wendy (BBC -- Live in the Studio 1964 - Mono)
29.    When I Grow Up (To Be A Man) (BBC -- Live in the Studio 1964 - Mono)
30.    Hushabye (BBC -- Live in the Studio 1964 - Mono)


I make that, for me, eighty-four things I don't have, ranging from at the one end "track I have but with a couple of seconds of talking at the beginning" to at the other "track I never heard of before last week". I suspect that the number is about the same for all but the most obsessive collector. Even assuming that the remastering adds nothing to the sound quality whatsoever, and that the packaging is worthless, that's still about $1.43 per track, assuming the $120 price that seems to be common in the US...

[Nicko1234]

Where has this myth that Mike vetos tracks left, right and centre come from exactly?

On this board it was due to Chinese whispers. Because Mike rejected WINBTLA for the TWOTS collection it became established fact that he would veto it for this box, then it became accepted that he would also veto Carry Me Home, then crossed wires meant that some people believed he had vetoed Carry Me Home back in the early 70s. Hilarious stuff.

[Wrightfan]

Edit: Someone really had the same idea as me at the same time? 

[Bean Bag]

So... your point is... what exactly ?

Overly expensive.  Paying for a lot of stuff I already have.  Missing a lot of stuff I don't have.

Don't be outraged on my behalf, please. I reserve my ire for people who are trying to make a point without actually knowing what kind of point they're supposed to be making, with insufficiently understood data.

I don't know what that means.

Seriously, I was trying to use an analogy/colorful examples to illustrate that this is expensive for what we're getting.  Picking apart an analogy, on literal terms is pointless to defend.  It's like saying "gosh, I'm tired" around a pregnant lady.  You're wrong no matter what.  

Ever thought of a career in politics ? 

Oh yeah, right!  I'm doing a bang up job getting votes 'round here!!  

[KokoNO]

As far as compilations go...

Fifty Big Ones - Pretty much presented in its entirety. We get a live version of "You're So Good To Me" and an alternate mix of "Break Away"...that's it.

Sounds Of Summer - All thirty tracks are pretty much on the boxed set in the same manner.

Warmth Of The Sun - This box is missing the aforementioned studio version of "You're So Good To Me"...it also doesn't feature "Then I Kissed Her" or "Cool, Cool Water"

Classics Selected By Brian Wilson - I guess Brian really does always get his way. All of the tracks from this release are on the boxed set in some capacity. We get The Smile Sessions version of "Wonderful" instead of the Smiley Smile version included on this CD. The box set has the Beach Boys' version of "California Feelin'" rather than the cut Brian made for this CD.

Summer Love Songs - This is the only other recent compilation of note. As it was a themed compilation rather than a Best Of, it has plenty of tracks that failed to make it into the box. ("In The Parkin' Lot", "Your Summer Dream", "Hushabye" - studio take, "I'm So Young", "Our Sweet Love" - original studio take, "Keep An Eye On Summer", "Don't Talk (Put Your Head On My Shoulder)"


This set pretty much supersedes the recent compilations. We're missing a whopping two songs from the last four Best Ofs. That's it.

[Nicko1234]

Even assuming that the remastering adds nothing to the sound quality whatsoever, and that the packaging is worthless, that's still about $1.43 per track, assuming the $120 price that seems to be common in the US...

Which is still far more expensive than the average CD.  

[AndrewHickey]

I genuinely think that the cries of 'rip-off' from one or two board members are fair enough if that's how people feel.

Not, though, when it's coming from people who'd been saying for months how much they were looking forward to the box set. We've known for a long time what kind of thing this would be, and complaining when it was first announced would make reasonable sense -- I quite possibly did myself (I can't be bothered to look back and check, but I'm not exactly keen on rebuying stuff I've already got either).

Complaining now -- loudly and repeatedly, so that any discussion of the box becomes dominated by people shrieking about how ripped-off they feel about something they're not buying anyway -- is just annoying.

[AndrewHickey]

Don't be outraged on my behalf, please. I reserve my ire for people who are trying to make a point without actually knowing what kind of point they're supposed to be making, with insufficiently understood data.

I don't know what that means.

Why am I not surprised?

[Bean Bag]

Ah, so what you mean by "Fifty Big Ones" is "Greatest Hits", and what you mean by "Greatest Hits" is "anything at all that was ever previously released".

Personally, I use the phrase "Greatest Hits" in a way that includes stuff that was a hit, not Sail Plane Song, We're Together Again, Soulful Old Man Sunshine, Fallin' In Love, Solar System or Surfers Rule...

Also, your original comment was:

t 2/3 of it is 50 Big Ones -- and not really a "Volume 2" of 50 Big Ones either.  It's the same thing, largely.

So by "greatest hits" you mean "stuff that was released on a rarities compilation once", by two-thirds you mean less than a third, and by 'not really a "Volume 2" of 50 Big Ones' you mean '50 Big Ones, Part 2;.

I see. That is definitely the intuitive, normal, logical way that everyone would read your comment, and not just something you've made up to save face.

The last 1/3 -- and maybe it's 38.689876%  (okay... I don't care!) -- is the stuff we'll be talking about once you agree with me and admit that we're paying A LOT of money for 2 (two and 1/2) discs.   

 

Well, I won't, and I suspect most other people here won't -- we'll be paying a lot of money for six discs. And as for you, you said the other day "Unless the price gets cut in half... It's not for me.  Not right now.  Maybe I'll get swept up in August.  Let's start the bidding at $55.00"

So no, "we" won't be paying a lot of money for two and a half discs, because you're not buying it and those of us who are are buying six discs, not two and a half.

I'd pay 55 bux for the 2 discs (or 1.678 discs, or 2.14567 discs -- whatever it is) that we're getting.  The rest is 50 Big Ones.  Deal with it.