I have always been curious about Mike's  penchant for writing "in the same room" with Brian.  I mean know they have done that in the past (The Warmth of the Sun comes to mind), but just once I would like one of these interviewers to ask Mike why that stipulation is so important to him.  Some of their greatest songs were in fact written the exact way that Mike now apparently despises.  Mike's  legendary tales of dictating the lyrics to Good Vibrations to his wife while driving to the studio and writing the lyrics to California Girls outside the recording studio being two examples.  If that worked so well on those classics, why is it so offensive now?

Yet another BB song that did not deserve its fate of languishing in a vault for nearly 20 years 'til the MIC box. They still had the goods in '95 to deliver a creditable album if everyone had been on the same page.

They still had the goods in 2012...

Getcha Back is the song that made me a Beach Boys fan. I've told this story here before, but it seems appropriate for this topic. June 1985 I am 17 years old and driving thru my town.  Getcha Back comes on the top 40 radio station and I am blown away. I immediately drive to the Wherehouse and buy the new cassette.  In the next few days I would also go back and purchase All Summer Long.  Later that summer I would pick up the just released update to David Leaf's book and watch the brand new American Band video. I remember seeing the band on MTV at Live Aid and even that early in my fandom thinking how great Brian looked and sounded at that show. That was a pretty good summer to become a Beach Boys fan. And now here we are 38 years later...

I am one who enjoys his latter day vocals even more than the early days. Where I Belong, Soul Searchin, the live SOS on MIC, live GOK from Philadelphia 7-4-95, Caroline, No from the 93 box set tour, all of SOP (despite the material he and Al were monsters on that album). 

I know its lost/recorded over, but man I was really hoping someone found a version of the Carl lead vocal of Sail On Sailor.

Yep

Have you read Cindy Lee Berryhill's account of the Beach Boys group session with Paley and Brian? That alone indicates a lot of more nuanced, weird, deep stuff was going on than simply someone thinking the material wasn't commercial. A lot of weird passive-aggressive stuff was going. And that was only on the more micro level when it came to actually literally working on the material. The larger political issues surrounding the organization were also at play. I've probably already gone on about a lot of that already in this thread.

Where can I find this?

I believe it was published in ESQ at or around the time of those sessions. 

To this day, I never understood what Carl's problem was...

I don't think we have anywhere near a full picture of Carl's opinion of the material. I don't believe he necessarily had a strong dislike for all of the material. All we really have is a bit of sketchy info that he didn't like the Don Was-produced backing track for "Soul Searchin'" (which we've never heard).

I think this mid-90s period with the Beach Boys and Brian (both separately and together) is still somewhat sketchy. I think there were still lingering issues with Brian's Landy period (and the fallout from his "autobiography"), and I think interpersonal issues and band politics sort of indirectly and directly impacted working the Paley sessions more than it was like an outright rejection of the actual songs/material.

In 1995, Brian hadn't been front and center leading a BB project in years, and was just in the process of doing the "Orange Crate Art" album (which he didn't write or produce) and the IJWMFTT film and soundtrack (which Brian didn't really produce on his own and had no original songs), so in the eyes of the band it was unclear if he could lead a project, and also whether they *wanted* that, whether they wanted to do another deal where Brian and an outside co-writer bring in all or most of the songs, and the guys just add vocals.

Recall as well that this was around the time (within a year or so) when the idea was thrown around to do a "Pet Sounds" tour with Brian and the band, and Carl supposedly didn't think Brian would be able to do it. Whether he was right or wrong at the time, or whether he was justified to feel that way or not, that speaks to how he and the band to some degree felt about having Brian as a heavy participant if not a leader on a project. I think they just felt unsure from a logistical point of view, and also the usual band politics colored things.

Mike and Brian's interactions at the "Soul Searchin'"/"You're Still a Mystery" vocal sessions speak to a weird antagonism that was still present. The band certainly was not just tripping over themselves running to Brian to service an album's worth of Brian/Andy songs.

That's not to say the material itself was not also a potential concern for some of them. Remember they were still doing stuff like the "Summer in Paradise" album, and you can see the material Carl worked on outside of the band at this time (the "Beckley/Lamm/Wilson" stuff) was very different. So I don't think some of the guys saw the value in doing an album of those Paley tracks that would have appealed more to critics and the nerd/indie contingent of Brian/BB fans that was growing in numbers at the time. This was the era of rather stale live setlists and not much studio activity. I think they were a bit on autopilot.

What did they end up working on? "Stars and Stripes", a project where an outsider (Joe Thomas not coincidentally) kind of pushed the project forward as the main producer (and I'd guess Thomas had his label involved, so he was probably putting money up front for the project too?). This all circles back to previous conversations about what it takes to get Brian or BB projects out the door for better or worse. Joe Thomas put up money and was willing to run these projects, and they got done. I don't think Andy Paley (or apparently even Don Was, a somewhat more Thomas-like figure just from a logistical point of view) were able to just put up a full album concept and the money, while also seeming to appeal to all members and not seem like an interloper. Joe Thomas wasn't going to get any songwriting credits or royalties on "Stars and Stripes"; Andy Paley was going to theoretically be a co-writer on *all* of the "Paley Sessions" songs.

yep

Having read the book, I suspect that the reasons C50, etc., weren't mentioned, was because, as the author made clear, the scope of the update was going to be limited to what he had more firsthand knowledge of. This becomes especially true during the time period that C50 would have fallen under, because he had serious matters in his own personal life to deal with, and that had to take priority. The update wasn't going to be a brand new biography as such, because, as he wrote, he felt that he was documenting Brian pretty much year-by-year in real time for awhile with the projects he was involved with.

I understand why that is the case, but still disappointing to me.

I was highly anticipating this as one of the very first things I read about the BB's was the 1985 version, which cemented my fandom that year at age 17.  Having received and read latest version over the weekend, I have to say I am disappointed.  Besides Leaf beating his own chest about how great the first book was (it was), my biggest letdown was the total absence of discussion on Brian's relationships with the group since 1985.  For instance, the aborted 1995 Don Was recording sessions is not even mentioned. The entire C50 negotiations, tour, album and aftermath (arguably the biggest event in the Beach Boys world sine the last version of this book) received a total of 1 sentence. What is there is good, I  was just hoping for a lot more.

That was a great run in 2012

1. Al mentions that the Wilsons have to switch places at a restaurant because Murray and Brian were lefthanded!! Is that factual?

I believe Carl was lefthanded. Don't know about Brian

Carl indeed wrote lefty (obviously played guitar right); Brian writes righty, throws a baseball lefty

Darn that Al Jardine.  Every time I think I'm out, he pulls me back in...

That's what George Costanza said (I think)!

Yeah, it’s from Seinfeld but they were referencing The Godfather part III (I think) when Michael is lamenting that he can’t leave the family business.

yes and yes. Michael Corleone then Costanza

Al just posted a birthday message for Mike and included “See you at the reunion”. 

Darn that Al Jardine.  Every time I think I'm out, he pulls me back in...

In the latest ESQ, there is mention of an attempted "takeover by bad people" of The Beach Boys in the early 80's. Anybody know anything about that?

When I read that in ESQ I thought Landy

I heard him say “a repackaging of Sounds of Summer with 3 cds and 2 other cds so it’s  sort of a box set deal”

Other than writing that It's About Time is sung by Dennis, I think the writer does a generally good job and has a solid list. IMO, there are two glaring omissions: When I Grow Up (to Be a Man) and Kiss Me Baby.

Here are 8 more from me to make 50:

Breakaway
Don't Talk (Put Your Head on Shoulder)
I'll Bet He's Nice
The Night Was So Young
Long Promised Road
We'll Run Away  -- my choice for most underrated BB song
Slip on Through  -- although Dennis is very well-represented on the writer's list
I'm Waiting For the Day

11. Don’t Talk (Put Your Head on My Shoulder) (1966)

https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/music/story/2022-01-07/beach-boys-bruce-johnston-the-weeknd-dawn-fm

Is that Rob Bonfligio or someone else, standing in Nicky Wonder's place?

Sure looks like Rob

Both Brian and Mike have their own shows booked through much of 2022, so there's certainly no way something on the magnitude of 2012's C50 could happen next year, at least not in the Spring/Summer.

Considering the timing, and the stuff they already have booked, and the way 2012 went down, I'd also guess a larger tour is unlikely.

I think they'd treat the 60th as more of a semi-hands-off multi-media project than an album/tour "reunion" cycle. Maybe that documentary Iconic has talked about, and a one-shot show (or short string of shows culled for a single airing/release). And *possibly* a new album? Not sure if they have the motivation and time to do another new album, especially if it's *not* leading up to a full tour.

Really though, how much time and effort went into the recording of TWGMTR by the actual principals?  Obviously, Brian (and maybe Mike to a lesser extent) would have to write material, but I'm not sure that the five Beach Boys were involved in more than just a handful of recording sessions.

Wow, the guy’s not pulling any punches. Shocked at his candor. Not surprised by his anecdotes, but still shocked he apparently didn’t sign the same NDA all of the others did

Hard to believe Carl didn't do either "Darlin'" or "I Can Hear Music". But he did sing the lead on their cover of "Dancin' In The Street".

Good catch. He tended to rotate the 2 from year to year in the 90's (along with either his all black or all white stage uniform). 91 was a Darlin' year

Hi all, my first time seeing the Beach Boys was 30 years ago at Cleveland Municipal Stadium after an Indians baseball game (June 1, 1991). I was about to turn 12. I've always wondered what the lineup for this concert was. I know Carl, Mike, Bruce and Al were there. I assume Brian wasn't there, but I was trying to confirm that.

From what I've been able to find, the backing band would have included:
-Adrian Baker
-Richie Cannata
-Ed Carter
-Billy Hinche
-Matt Jardine
-Mike Kowalski
-Mike Meros

Did I miss anyone?

According to SetList.fm, they played the following:
-California Girls
-You're So Good to Me
-Then I Kissed Her
-Please Let Me Wonder
-Be True to Your School
-Don't Worry Baby
-Dancing in the Street
-Dance, Dance, Dance
-Do You Wanna Dance?
-Rock and Roll Music
-Surfer Girl
-Still Cruisin'
-Little Deuce Coupe
-409
-The Little Old Lady From Pasadena
-Shut Down
-G.T.O.
-I Get Around
-In My Room
-God Only Knows
-Sloop John B
-Wouldn't It Be Nice
-Good Vibrations
-Kokomo
-Help Me, Rhonda
-Barbara Ann
-Fun, Fun, Fun

Encore:
-Wipe Out
-Surfin' Safari
-Surf City
-Surfin' U.S.A.
(Source: https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/the-beach-boys/1991/cleveland-stadium-cleveland-oh-43d35feb.html)

Thank you for any input!

Probably played Do It Again somewhere near the opening

Excellent listen. Thanks for posting

With the release of "Feel Flows" I thought now would be as good a time as any to bring this article up again, in case someone hasn't read it.

Thanks, I hadn’t seen it before now

Anyone know the approximate date of the letter?  Whether it dates from May or August 1997 could tell a lot about its intentions...