Enjoying this, one of my favorite live BBs things ever: 1964 Ready Steady Go! from the UK. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCYouoLKxjo&feature=related

I think you mean "factions."

Getcha Back did have Brian doing the falsetto. It sounds like it was run through a lot of machines but it's still Brian.

I know you're probably right, but I've always had a hard time buying this.  Heavily processed or not, its just too perfect a 22 year old Brian vocal to be believeable for me. 

Foskett was (and still can be) a dead ringer for young Brian, so it makes more sense that its him singing that. 

See, I don't think the falsetto on "Getcha Back" sounds like young Brian--I think it sounds like an older, cleaned-up Brian, which is why I've never questioned it being Brian.

Ditto.

I very strongly stand behind my statement. It's not me intentionally being difficult (not that I ever would...). I am being honest. Wipeout. By far.

Oh, and my vote for worst Beach Boys song: a tie of everything done after KTSA (which, while pretty bad itself, is Pet Sounds compared to what came after).

Luther, I'm shocked? What about Wipe Out? I thought that was your favourite?

Actually, you know what, I forgot about that. I do love Wipe Out. I take that one back. It is easily my favorite post KTSA BBs song. Not even close.

Like most Miles albums, brilliant.Maybe not in my top half dozen, but that's only because there are such great ones to pick from.

Oh, and my vote for worst Beach Boys song: a tie of everything done after KTSA (which, while pretty bad itself, is Pet Sounds compared to what came after).

I'll vehemently argue that lyrics aren't necessarily "roughly half" of a song: it's all dependent on the song in question and the particular mindset of the listener. For some lyric-leaning artists, lyrics may be far more than half a song. (Lou Reed keeps using the same three chords ... it isn't those that make him a genius.) And I have friends who hate the Beach Boys, and the reason isn't that they deny the great melodies or harmonies: they can't stand the lyrics.

Nothing is ever so easy as fifty-fifty.

The mature BBs, with Matt and Carl, well recorded and rehearsed, still had this matchless blend.

And with all the "studio magic" that people around here constantly, publicly abhor. There's a lot more going on there than some guys standing around a mic.

Rediculous ... and overuse of ellipses ... when a sentence really should end ... I mean, shouldn't it? ... because they don't have to wander ... bunch of semi-coherent, semi-connected half-thoughts? ... and of course the misspellings (see rediculous) ... that's what pisses me off lately.

There's no accounting for taste. And I don't mean that as an insult.

I'd agree that the music they made can't be replicated. But it's not magic. And other music can be made, should be made and deserves to be heard without the specter of both what was real and what is mythological casting an absurdly large shadow. In the case of certain bands who shall remain nameless (literally, actually), that's hard to do when one considers whose material they're doing most of the time.

Don't make me quote Mick n keith: "It's the singer, not the song"!!

Of course it's not magic as in some Warlock in a castle somewhere stewing a pot of pig's feet and baby hearts, but music IS alchemy to a large extent. To make music, one has to manipulate the elements (air, electricity, ect) and the human soul/mind/heart/body and combine it all into something that gets pushed through wires and tubes and splatters itself on a vinyl record or a CD or MP3 or be sung/played out through speakers n mics, drums, guitars on a stage..... There's nothing wrong with being touched in a deep, spiritual way via communication through music.....I mean, I could drop quote after quote from Brian and Carl and Dennis blathering on and on about such things.... Of course, one can take a more academic remove and say it's all by and by and anyone can sing play and touch the world just as much as the Beatles and The Beach Boys did, but it's simply not true and not half as fun!!!!! I mean,  IF the Beach Boys music has touched me in such a profound way (assuming I'm not the only one)......  just what are the real chances that it has NOTHING to do with the individuals who wrote sang and played on the records and performed onstage?

The song may be nothing without the singer, but the converse is just as true, all that "sing the phonebook" bullshit notwithstanding.

That particular batch. Saying such things bluntly is alright with me, but when everyone else is wrong and you were always right, why bother?

What the hell, Luther? You were going on and on about sacred cows, and now you're going out of your way to defend that wankfest. You really need some 'Genius is Pain'. 

I'm not defending anything except the practice of bringing things down to earth.

Yes, it's a wankfest. Yes, he was bitter. And yes, he thought way too much of himself. That said, the myth-busting is valuable. (Fits right into my theme of the moment of 'it's not all or nothing.')

I'd agree with you if Mr. Lennon didn't point fingers at everyone who had been part of his life... but himself.

Which part don't you agree with? Mythbusting being valuable or that particular batch of it? Regardless, there's something essential about hearing someone say such things bluntly, whatever his other sins.

I'd agree that the music they made can't be replicated. But it's not magic. And other music can be made, should be made and deserves to be heard without the specter of both what was real and what is mythological casting an absurdly large shadow. In the case of certain bands who shall remain nameless (literally, actually), that's hard to do when one considers whose material they're doing most of the time.

Yes, it's a wankfest. Yes, he was bitter. And yes, he thought way too much of himself. That said, the myth-busting is valuable. (Fits right into my theme of the moment of 'it's not all or nothing.')

No, I love the Beach Boys. Along with the Velvet Underground, Beatles and Tom Waits, they're my favorite band ever. But fandom doesn't have to equal worship. There's nothing wrong with cool-headedness. I can love (and I'm making these numbers up, which is hopefully obvious) 15%, like 50%, feel ambivalent toward 20% and actively hate 15% without the latter 15% affecting the positive 65% at all. It's not an all-or-nothing life. We don't all have to be little David Leafs.

Isn't that kind of like saying Beatlemania is better than the Beatles?

I mean, Beatlemania might BE better than the Beatles in terms of all their harmonies being spot on and note perfect every song/every time and their playing might be more polished and tighter than the actual Beatles...... BUT.....

........ they're NOT the Beatles.

.... Brian's band is NOT the Beach Boys....

It would be more like that if someone from Beatlemania had put together and gotten released an unfinished Sgt. Pepper, and another one had gotten together with Paul and co-written a very solid album. As much as people want the Wilson band to be nothing but soulless, lifeless karaoke machines, it just isn't true. Everyone is entitled to his opinion over which is better, but belittle the other in the process isn't really necessary.

Nah, it's like saying that McCartney's live band in the 2000s runs circles around the Beatles, because their Paperback Writer is spot on while the renditions in the 1966 world tour were a bit in the sloppy side.

Still, would anyone here exchange a time travel to the Candlestick farewell concert for a Paul solo gig in 2006? Step on, oh people who want to hear performances just-like-the-record!  

No, it really isn't like that at all.

Ok, how isn't it?

It isn't in that I never said the current band runs circles around the Beach Boys. Never even implied it. If anything, you could have said something like "Paul's band is more technically accurate than the Beatles were," which may be true (although not paying attention to McCartney, I have no idea). The judgment calls are all your (that's plural--southern y'all, spanish vosotros) doing, not mine. I'm not talking about technical differences, not qualitative ones.

No, you don't get what I'm saying. You're proving it further with every post. See, I didn't say that it's necessarily better to be note-perfect. Neither did I suggest the Beach Boys were an inferior band (which their body of work would easily refute, as much as I love the Wondermints...). All I've been saying is that 1) the Beach Boys didn't sing as accurately live, on stage, as the current band, and 2) the current band is nowhere near as faceless or soulless as they are constantly ragged on for being. That's it. I'm sorry I don't believe in the magic that some of you seem to, the undefinable quality (it's called "nostalgia" by the way) or blend that the old band had. The band--bands, really--was (were) great. But it wasn't Jesus, Buddha, Ganesha, Odin and Zeus up there: it was just a bunch of different guys over the years. They weren't a singularly angel-touched band. They were guys who sang well, played all right, wrote some great, a lot of good and some dogshit songs. Sometimes I think the post-Beatles breakup Lennon interviews should be daily required reading for everyone.

Isn't that kind of like saying Beatlemania is better than the Beatles?

I mean, Beatlemania might BE better than the Beatles in terms of all their harmonies being spot on and note perfect every song/every time and their playing might be more polished and tighter than the actual Beatles...... BUT.....

........ they're NOT the Beatles.

.... Brian's band is NOT the Beach Boys....

It would be more like that if someone from Beatlemania had put together and gotten released an unfinished Sgt. Pepper, and another one had gotten together with Paul and co-written a very solid album. As much as people want the Wilson band to be nothing but soulless, lifeless karaoke machines, it just isn't true. Everyone is entitled to his opinion over which is better, but belittle the other in the process isn't really necessary.

Nah, it's like saying that McCartney's live band in the 2000s runs circles around the Beatles, because their Paperback Writer is spot on while the renditions in the 1966 world tour were a bit in the sloppy side.

Still, would anyone here exchange a time travel to the Candlestick farewell concert for a Paul solo gig in 2006? Step on, oh people who want to hear performances just-like-the-record!  

No, it really isn't like that at all. And I don't think anyone said they necessarily want to hear performances just like the record. But I give up. Dennis was cute, Carl was an angel, Brian was a tortured genius, Mike didn't like to f*** with the formula, Blondie and Ricky added muscle to the live show, Bruce sucks ass and Al is short. Oh, and David was forgotten for a long time. There. Now I'm in lock-step with the orthodoxy. gods bless America.

[i]

There is nothing ridiculous about anything I have said, in principle or otherwise. And by hinting that anything I've said would imply that I think the band ought to go re-record Beach Boys albums just tells me this discussion may as well end, because you're not getting what I am saying at all.

I don't think there is anything ridiculous at all about saying the Beach Boys couldn't perform as accurately on stage as Brian's band does. I've never heard anything to convince me otherwise. Unfortunately, there isn't a way to know for sure, in that the Beach Boys weren't able to perform live in an environment with quality monitors with which to hear themselves--at least not when they could sing anywhere near their peaks. But don't assume that just because they put the music on album, they could pull it off so well live--not in terms of accuracy. You can talk about the intangibles/imaginary stuff all you want and there is no disputing such things. But hitting the right notes: nope. Nowhere near as consistently good.

Isn't that kind of like saying Beatlemania is better than the Beatles?

I mean, Beatlemania might BE better than the Beatles in terms of all their harmonies being spot on and note perfect every song/every time and their playing might be more polished and tighter than the actual Beatles...... BUT.....

........ they're NOT the Beatles.

.... Brian's band is NOT the Beach Boys....

It would be more like that if someone from Beatlemania had put together and gotten released an unfinished Sgt. Pepper, and another one had gotten together with Paul and co-written a very solid album. As much as people want the Wilson band to be nothing but soulless, lifeless karaoke machines, it just isn't true. Everyone is entitled to his opinion over which is better, but belittle the other in the process isn't really necessary.

I guess this goes on all the time in the music industry or any industry for that matter. We all want a bigger slice of the cake but sometimes the numbers just don't justify it.  ...
I also read a story about Joe Cocker being on the road and his normal piano player got offered more to tour with (I think) David Bowie. Now who wouldn't do the same?

A lot of that is right on. Many fans are too often put themselves in a judgmental position about artists' economic decisions. But let's be honest, it's easy to sit back and say this bandleader shouldn't have done this commercial, should have kept this musician. Or that this musician shouldn't have taken this or that job. And those fans base it on blurry ideas of artistic integrity, which are easy terms to throw around when you're making a solid wage as a whateverthefuckyoudo. But we all need to make a living. If Brian Wilson needs cheaper musicians, or if Of Montreal has to sell a song to Outback Steakhouse, that's just the way it goes.

[criticisms are welcome]

I wanted to make a Dennis Wilson comp to give to a friend, and for me to put on in the spur of the moment. I wanted to focus on the POB/Bamboo material, and I wanted to pick only the best (IMO) songs. I didn't want to fill an entire 80 min. CD (might be too overwhelming, could be a downer), and I wanted it to flow nicely, highlighting all of Dennis' moods. This is what I came up with, it times out at about 58 minutes, criticisms are welcome:

Dennis Wilson

1. Pacific Ocean Blues
2. Tug Of Love
3. Dreamer
4. Time
5. You And I
6. Moonshine
7. Common
8. Thoughts Of You
9. Holy Man
10. Rainbows
11. Only With You
12. River Song
13. Love Remember Me
14. Farewell My Friend
15. End Of The Show
16. Piano Variations On Thoughts Of You

Too much Dennis Wilson.