50th Anniversary, The SMiLE box, the reunion, new material and things to come

[Jason]

Basically they sold their votes on them to Brian. I believe it was in 1996 or so. Before then a release had to be approved by all the members of BRI. Since then, Brian makes the decisions.

[Cam Mott]

Basically they sold their votes on them to Brian. I believe it was in 1996 or so. Before then a release had to be approved by all the members of BRI. Since then, Brian makes the decisions.

Really. I've never heard this. Just on the SMiLE recordings?

[Jason]

The recordings themselves, yes.

[BJL]

Also - sorry, fellow fans - while musicheads would grab it, the further out this goes, the less interest there will be among music consumers generally, assuming they aren't getting all their music via subscription services or download/upload servers by then.  Hard copies and maybe a vinyl pressing will be luxury items for collector-types who dig that sort of thing.  Over time the public will more and more be consigning the BB to the boomer oldies scrapheap along with the Drifters, Four Seasons, CCR, the Rascals and other perfectly good bands but the memory thereof recedes as the years advance.

The speculation of what such a box set would contain is interesting, though.

I think you underestimate:
a) the incredible influence/stock put in the beach boys by indie/lowfi music in the 90s and today, making the audience essentially two large groups of "music heads" ... the young and the old, which would add up to considerable interest. 

also, the press would jump on it, i imagine, as they did with BWPS.  I mean look how many copies dennis wilson sold.  and most of that, my sense is, was not to aging boomers, it was to young people who hear their favorite bands from the last decade say, "man that dennis wilson, his record was so hard to find in the 80s but we dug it hard" or reading about it in pitchfork or whatever. 

basically, the smile audience isn't going away for a long time. 

[Andrew G. Doe]

Due to Brian owning the rights to the material...

Flag on the play - Brian does not (as far as I'm aware, and as ever, stand to be corrected) own the rights to Smile. Capitol (currently) does - they paid for the sessions. Yes, when the band left, they took with them the rights to all the post 1965 albums, but these rights (along with those for all the post 1969 material) were leased to Capitol for the 2000 Brother 2fers, and that deal was renewed a few years later. For whatever reason, Capitol are deferring to Brian's wishes. Trust me, the moment he says "yes", there'll be a box out so fast you'll hear the sonic boom. 

[Loaf]

Due to Brian owning the rights to the material...

For whatever reason, Capitol are deferring to Brian's wishes. Trust me, the moment he says "yes", there'll be a box out so fast you'll hear the sonic boom. 

AGD, do you think Brian is planning for this to be a posthumous release (whenever that may be)?

or at least once his recording career has definitely finished?

[Bean Bag]

Due to Brian owning the rights to the material...

Flag on the play - Brian does not (as far as I'm aware, and as ever, stand to be corrected) own the rights to Smile. Capitol (currently) does - they paid for the sessions. Yes, when the band left, they took with them the rights to all the post 1965 albums, but these rights (along with those for all the post 1969 material) were leased to Capitol for the 2000 Brother 2fers, and that deal was renewed a few years later. For whatever reason, Capitol are deferring to Brian's wishes. Trust me, the moment he says "yes", there'll be a box out so fast you'll hear the sonic boom. 

AGD...since you say that Brian does NOT own the SMiLE music -- by saying that Capitol would release a box in second with Brian's approval -- are you also suggesting that this might be to avoid any "issues" with surviving members?  Mike I guess, really.

OR are you just saying Capital would be all over it, just because?

[Wrightfan]

....hmm.

You know...I'm still haunted by a twelve track SMiLE.

Eh, I kinda see SMiLE as a 12 track album since they really never worked on "I'm on Great Shape" that much...unless they did and it's hidden in Al Capone's vault 

[TheLazenby]

Well, if a boxed set or at least a proper "Smile" album isn't a possibility, have 'em plunder the vaults and Brian cram together a cohesive 20-minute "Heroes and Villains / I'm In Great Shape / Barnyard" suite.  There, problem solved. :-P

[Andrew G. Doe]

Capitol have been aching to release a Smile box for over 20 years: they've gone so far as announcing one at least once. They're well aware of the kudos, if not the financial reward, that such a release would bring them. They're up for it, big time.

It's been argued that 'Brian' blocking the box was because it would overshadow BWPS... but that was back in 2004 when it was confidently stated (not predicted, but stated, as a fact) that said album would go gold by December, and by a name everyone here would know. Five years later, that still hasn't happened, and if anything, releasing a Smile Sessions 1966-67 box would boost the sales of BWPS (such as they are). Such a box will be released, when Brian's management sees fit. My impression is that the Gershwin project could be a major work, prolonging his solo career for a few years yet. So... a release in 2016 ?

[Mike's Beard]

If your prediction turns out to be correct it'll still be out way before Al's solo CD.

[Alex]

Over time the public will more and more be consigning the BB to the boomer oldies scrapheap along with the Drifters, Four Seasons, CCR, the Rascals and other perfectly good bands but the memory thereof recedes as the years advance.

Hey, I'm only 24 and I listen to all those bands!

[The Shift]

Capitol have been aching to release a Smile box for over 20 years: they've gone so far as announcing one at least once. They're well aware of the kudos, if not the financial reward, that such a release would bring them. They're up for it, big time.

It's been argued that 'Brian' blocking the box was because it would overshadow BWPS... but that was back in 2004 when it was confidently stated (not predicted, but stated, as a fact) that said album would go gold by December, and by a name everyone here would know. Five years later, that still hasn't happened, and if anything, releasing a Smile Sessions 1966-67 box would boost the sales of BWPS (such as they are). Such a box will be released, when Brian's management sees fit. My impression is that the Gershwin project could be a major work, prolonging his solo career for a few years yet. So... a release in 2016 ?

Waddya mean it hasn't gone gold yet? THE album of the year, 2004, rave reviews, sell-out concerts (with folk in evening attire, I remember, for the debut!), named album of the decade here and there and it STILL ain't gone gold?   There are at least nine copies in this household alone... doesn't everyone here have nine copies?  I bet Mike Love has a couple (factory sealed) at least to give his lawyers.

What does something have to sell these days to go gold?

[Jason]

I believe it sold something like 700,000 units total, but we're talking worldwide. Usually, specific to each country, their recording industries have their own values as to what constitutes a gold record. In the USA and UK, it's 500,000 units sold IN THAT COUNTRY to be considered a gold record. I think in the UK BWPS sold around 300,000 and was (I think) a #8 album. In USA it was #13, and I believe sold around 150,000-200,000.

And all this time I thought Beach Boys fans didn't equate commercial success with artistic quality. I'm crushed. Really, I am. It can be Album of the Year/Decade/Century/All-Time, have a hundred and thirty-seven rave reviews, be the subject of SOME sold-out concerts (let's NOT get greedy now...), but if it ain't a bloody gold record, the fan community goes into a core dump and leaves us a collective blue screen of death? 

[The Shift]

... if it ain't a bloody gold record, the fan community goes into a core dump and leaves us a collective blue screen of death? 

Curious choice of screen colour that – Bloo?

I simply gobsmacked that it didn't notch gold after all the wonderful OTT publicity it had.

Oh, and the music was okay too.

[Jason]

Hey man, it just goes to prove that storied point that it doesn't matter how good it is but how marketable it is. Roughly 700,000 copies sold worldwide is admirable for Brian's standards, but statistically insignificant in the long run. Unless of course it's a situation like Pet Sounds with a ton of uncatalogued sales - in which case, in 2038, the album will be certified gold around the world and platinum a month later!

[The Shift]

Hey man, it just goes to prove that storied point that it doesn't matter how good it is but how marketable it is. Roughly 700,000 copies sold worldwide is admirable for Brian's standards, but statistically insignificant in the long run. Unless of course it's a situation like Pet Sounds with a ton of uncatalogued sales - in which case, in 2038, the album will be certified gold around the world and platinum a month later!

you're right -  an' this could be a slow burner that sells steadily for many years to come rather than a flash in the pan.

[Jason]

Slow burner, perhaps. Slow burner on the level of, say, Dark Side of the Moon, doubtful. Just the fact that it sold about 700,000 worldwide and was a top 20 LP in many territories is quite admirable for Brian as a solo performer, and he most certainly does deserve it. To use the tired old saying, he was made for these times for once. Certainly, it charted higher than any Beach Boys album since 15 Big Ones - not even the Sounds of Summer compilation was as big of a success on the charts, although it did eventually go over double platinum in the USA in mid-2006.

Even the DVD sold very respectably. I would say, considering Brian's standing as a solo artist independent of the Beach Boys as well as his track record as a solo artist before BWPS came around, the BWPS project was a resounding success.

Certainly, that should be good enough.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Waddya mean it hasn't gone gold yet? THE album of the year, 2004, rave reviews, sell-out concerts (with folk in evening attire, I remember, for the debut!), named album of the decade here and there and it STILL ain't gone gold?   There are at least nine copies in this household alone... doesn't everyone here have nine copies?  I bet Mike Love has a couple (factory sealed) at least to give his lawyers.

What does something have to sell these days to go gold?

In the US, to go gold you have to sell 500,000 copies with dollar sales of at least $1 million, based on one-third of the list price (no, I don't know what it means either, but that's what the RIAA rules are). A UK gold album needs to sell 100,000 copies - which BWPS did by November 19th the year it was released. The UK platinum level is 300,000 sales, which it has yet to achieve.

Brian Wilson reportedly sold 450,000 when originally released in the US.

The BWPS DVD has been certified as platinum in the US, which means it sold over 50,000 units (as a 2-disc package, both DVDs counted towards the 100,000 required).

Although BWPS debuted high in the US chart (#13), it didn't have that long a run - 17 weeks - and nine of those weeks were spent outside the top 150. Thus:

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[Pretty Funky]

For dummys like me, are down loaded albums included or just hard-copy CDs?

I would imagine the lack of a hit single on a album would cost album sales. GV while a different version to us, was just a BW solo for most so lacked the home run of say a 'Money' that Dark Side had.

[Matt H]

Brian Wilson reportedly sold 450,000 when originally released in the US.

Would a reissue count towards the total?  I would think that the reissue of Brian Wilson would have sold 50,000 copies, thus pushing the album to Gold status in the US.

[Runaways]

I'd def buy the boxset just cause those original sessions are very good companion pieces.  hearing the Purple Chick version helped me appreciate BWPS and vise versa.

[Awesoman]

Maybe with some guests like The Band did in "Last Waltz".

NO. Why do people think this a good idea? The Band started off as a backing band, they were showing their strengths in doing other people's songs. Did you notice that it wasn't other people singing The Band covers?

Aside from that, this things become dated really quickly. The 20th anniversary special sucked because of all those guests. Maybe it seemed cool at the time, but just look at it now.

Yes but in "The Last Waltz" they weren't for the most part random people up there on stage with them.  They were people who's careers had crossed paths with The Band musically.  My suggestion was more along those lines.  Blondie Chaplin getting up on stage and busting out "Sail on Sailor "like it was '73 again? Macca playing bass to "God Only Knows"? Dean joining them for a"Barbara Ann" sing-along? How about Van Dyke Parks performing one or two Smile numbers with them?  Does this really sound that shite to you?

It sounds quite unrealistic.

[Mike's Beard]

It does read like a bit of a fan's wishlist in retrospect but I can dream can't I? Hey while I'm at it - may I propose a live satellite link up from 'ole Charlie Manson's cell for a duet of "Never Learn not to Love"! LOL.  When I posted the original comment I was a little taken back by how strongly opposed to the idea Aegir  was. I think he may have had visions of me petitioning to get Lady Ga Ga up on stage with them or something.

[Jason]

I think he may have had visions of me petitioning to get Lady Ga Ga up on stage with them or something.

Don't knock the GaGa, she's the rare pop star in modern times who knows what she's talking about.