Why didn't Brian just release Smile as a solo album back in '67?

[BJL]

Has anyone ever tried to track down the reporter responsible for the "cowboy song" quote about child is the father of the man?  I wonder if he would remember something more, or have more extensive notes that didn't make the article?  Because it's just that one line, a "cowboy song" which is so confusing about that dennis interview.  How the heck is child is the father a cowboy song?   And how would the reporter know if not from a verse lyric.  Could Dennis have introduced it as such?  why?  or, if dennis was just playing pieces he knew on the piano, perhaps what the reporter actually heard was some fragment of heroes and villians, and misunderstood the titles?  As for the 5-6 minute heroes, i remain ever optomistic!  There are many places in the world such an acetate could be hiding!

[Jasper]

We have a basically finished Wind Chimes

According to the Mike Vosse article Brian recorded chimes and bells at different speeds during the piano part. That's why I think there was more even to the songs we consider finished these days.
"You're Welcome" is missing on your list, the first and only released finished song from the original SMiLE sessions.

[tomstuart]

Why didn't Brian just release SMiLE as a solo record? Because, as we discovered in 2004, it'd be nowhere near as good without the rest of the Beach Boys vocal contributions...

[runnersdialzero]

Why didn't Brian just release SMiLE as a solo record? Because, as we discovered in 2004, it'd be nowhere near as good without the rest of the Beach Boys vocal contributions...

Or Brian releasing Smile in 1967 and Brian releasing Smile in 2004 could not be more different situations.

[Bicyclerider]

We have a basically finished Wind Chimes

According to the Mike Vosse article Brian recorded chimes and bells at different speeds during the piano part. That's why I think there was more even to the songs we consider finished these days.
"You're Welcome" is missing on your list, the first and only released finished song from the original SMiLE sessions.

Not exactly.  No chimes or bells, what Vosse described was an alternate mix Brian played on acetate where he faded in the vocals in the break one at a time, building up the rhythm, the voices sounding “like little percussion instruments.”  This mix hopefully exists somewhere on acetate (Durrie Parks).

Your point that even the seemingly "finished" tracks lacking only a lead vocal would have likely undergone revision and changes in the mix (particularly use of echo, fading out the instrumental track in spots, an instrumental overdub here and there) is certainly valid.  But these "almost completed" tracks would not have taken long to complete, assuming Brian knew what he wanted to do with them and could commit to finish them.

[Roger Ryan]

Has anyone ever tried to track down the reporter responsible for the "cowboy song" quote about child is the father of the man?  I wonder if he would remember something more, or have more extensive notes that didn't make the article?  Because it's just that one line, a "cowboy song" which is so confusing about that dennis interview.  How the heck is child is the father a cowboy song?   And how would the reporter know if not from a verse lyric.

For what it's worth, the guitar rhythm on the verse along with the harmonica (doing the "baby wail") make the track sound like a "cowboy song". Of course, Dennis was reportedly playing this on the piano, right? If he retained that loping "Happy Trails" rhythm when playing it for the reporter, I could see how it might be mistaken for a country & western number, especially when compared to the rhythm styles and melodies the Beach Boys were known for up until that point.

[Richard Head]

Why didn't Brian just release SMiLE as a solo record? Because, as we discovered in 2004, it'd be nowhere near as good without the rest of the Beach Boys vocal contributions...

I like you. A lot.

[mikes beard]

As for putting out an alternate album of left overs to buy time - that was Smiley Smile, wasn't it?  

This quote got me thinking ; has anyone anywhere EVER read or heard an interview where Brian talks about Smiley Smile?  I cannot even think of one single reference he has made to it in 43 years!!  It seems to be a complete mystery as to what he actually thinks about the album.  Is he proud of it? Embarrassed?  Does he think it's a steaming pile of dog turds?  Does he consider it better than Smile? Does he acknowledge it was a mistake?  Lots of questions I know (I know!) but it does seem strange that the we have the pivotal album in the BB's career - the LP whose Butterfly Effect  would shape everything that would befall them in the future.............  and we have no idea or even statement on how the main culprit feels about it.

[Jasper]

Not exactly.  No chimes or bells, what Vosse described was an alternate mix Brian played on acetate where he faded in the vocals in the break one at a time, building up the rhythm, the voices sounding “like little percussion instruments.”  This mix hopefully exists somewhere on acetate (Durrie Parks).

From the Mike Vosse article:
"He took the tail end of "Wind Chimes" - which the way it was originally recorded was, again much more beautiful than on Smiley Smile - and he had a minute and a half tag on it where he took a stand-up tack piano and a grand piano and, a track at a time, did little music box overdubs and then he went in and mixed them with different echoes on different channels into ... I've never heard anything like it.

[A Million Units In Jan!]

As for putting out an alternate album of left overs to buy time - that was Smiley Smile, wasn't it?  

This quote got me thinking ; has anyone anywhere EVER read or heard an interview where Brian talks about Smiley Smile?  I cannot even think of one single reference he has made to it in 43 years!!  It seems to be a complete mystery as to what he actually thinks about the album.  Is he proud of it? Embarrassed?  Does he think it's a steaming pile of dog turds?  Does he consider it better than Smile? Does he acknowledge it was a mistake?  Lots of questions I know (I know!) but it does seem strange that the we have the pivotal album in the BB's career - the LP whose Butterfly Effect  would shape everything that would befall them in the future.............  and we have no idea or even statement on how the main culprit feels about it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRFE-24ucxc

[Sam_BFC]

I also read an interview somewhere where Brian just describes it as their 'sto-o-ned' album or something like that haha.

[Cam Mott]

Not exactly.  No chimes or bells, what Vosse described was an alternate mix Brian played on acetate where he faded in the vocals in the break one at a time, building up the rhythm, the voices sounding “like little percussion instruments.”  This mix hopefully exists somewhere on acetate (Durrie Parks).

From the Mike Vosse article:
"He took the tail end of "Wind Chimes" - which the way it was originally recorded was, again much more beautiful than on Smiley Smile - and he had a minute and a half tag on it where he took a stand-up tack piano and a grand piano and, a track at a time, did little music box overdubs and then he went in and mixed them with different echoes on different channels into ... I've never heard anything like it.

And that is just a description of the tag we know isn't it?

[runnersdialzero]

This mix hopefully exists somewhere on acetate (Durrie Parks).

ARRRGGGHHHHH.

Has it ever been said why Van Dyke can't get to these? Absolutely mind boggling to think what could be on those acetates. Could be little of interest, but at the same time... :|

[Richard Head]

I think if the Durrie Parks acetates were of interest to Brian's entourage (since he owns the rights to the recordings), they would have been borrowed, catalogued, copied to tape, and returned by now. Keep in mind, these acetates might not exactly be on the shortlist of lost treasures on shellac. Not everything is as important as the Velvet Underground and Nico 1966 acetate.

And plus too, the acetates might be of negligible musical interest, not to mention sound quality.

Let's take stock of what circulates from the Smile sessions from acetate sources, in chronological order -

Prayer rough mix, 10/4/66 (1:07)
Prayer rough mix, 10/4/66 (deliberate edit of vocal phrase before the "hmmmmm") (0:58)
Cabinessence backing track, 10/11/66 (4:05)
The Old Master Painter "final" mono mix, 11/30/66 (1:08)
The Old Master Painter "part 2" mono mix, 11/30/66 (1:12)
The Old Master Painter "part 2" mono mix ("Barnshine"), 11/30/66 (0:53)
Cabinessence chorus rough mix, 12/6/66 (0:29)
Cabinessence verse/chorus/tag rough mix, 12/6/66 (later booted in two-track binaural stereo from tape source) (2:25)
Child Is Father of the Man tag/bridge/chorus rough mix, 12/6/66 (1:55)
Child Is Father of the Man tag/chorus/bridge/chorus rough mix, 12/6/66 (1:41)
Barnyard mono mix, 12/13/66 (1:02)
Do You Like Worms parts 1-3 rough mix, 12/21/66 (different vocal parts during Hawaiian section) (3:36)
Heroes and Villains verse rough mix, 12/22/66 (Brian lead vocal, heavily reverbed) (0:52)
Cabinessence chorus/tag rough mix, 12/27/66 (later booted in two-track binaural stereo from tape source) (1:46)
Cabinessence "finished" verse/chorus/verse/chorus/tag mix, 12/27/66 (Carl's reference for the 20/20 version) (3:22)
Heroes and Villains "Bicycle Rider" mono mix, 1/5/67 (features prevalent "what have you done" vocals) (0:32)
Heroes and Villains "Bicycle Rider" mono mix, 1/5/67 (features less prevalent "what have you done" vocals) (0:31)

[runnersdialzero]

I think if the Durrie Parks acetates were of interest to Brian's entourage (since he owns the rights to the recordings), they would have been borrowed, catalogued, copied to tape, and returned by now. Keep in mind, these acetates might not exactly be on the shortlist of lost treasures on shellac.

Still - I would bet that if this had been done yet, it would have been done after 93 when the Good Vibrations box came out. No mention has been made of them being recovered etc. and we certainly haven't heard anything.

[Paul]

Is there any idea of how many of these acetates exist?  Durrie Parks has some apparently, Bruce has said he has one at least, and I would think Brian would have some, or one of the other band members possibly. 

[hypehat]

Hasn't Mark said that they have catalogued every single piece of Smile material? I remember reading that here last year. Does that render the Durrie acetates redundant?

[BJL]

I wonder, were some key treasure to be found, on say the durrie parks acetates, would those in the know say anything about it?  or would they just make a few safeties and bide their time until the long awaited day when it can be released officially? 

[mikes beard]

Thanks for the link.  Brian sorta tells us alot without actually saying too much if you know what I mean.

[A Million Units In Jan!]

Thanks for the link.  Brian sorta tells us alot without actually saying too much if you know what I mean.

I know. He sorta skims over the fact that he had just wasted hundreds of thousands of dollars and countless recording sessions just to 'junk it'.