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683255 Posts in 27763 Topics by 4096 Members - Latest Member: MrSunshine July 29, 2025, 11:05:03 AM
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Author Topic: Brian Facebook picture with the Pet Sounds Masters?  (Read 11080 times)
Alan Smith
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I'm still here bitches and I know everything. –A


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« Reply #50 on: February 27, 2016, 12:11:01 PM »

They do, but we're talking now about a 50 year old precious, likely fragile tape.  They could still do the show using digital multi's.

That makes sense to me too. Yet, I've seen numerous instances of running multi-track tapes from the 60s and 70s on relatively recent documentaries. They still appear to run Beatles tapes on a few modern-era documentaries.

I've actually heard Beatles multis from the 60s are in excellent shape due to not being played a ton of times, and the non-synthetic makeup of the tape of that era. I wonder if perhaps a similar fact is true of Beach Boys tapes from the 60s.
Dumb question, but wouldn't you need to run 'em through a machine every now and then (perhaps not over the tape head) to stop them gumming up/sticking together over time?

There are others far more familiar with that stuff than myself. But my understanding is that because they used "whale oil" instead of synthetic oil on tape from the 60s, they don't suffer from as much (or maybe any?) of the gummy, sticky issues that occur with tape from the 70s and 80s. It's tapes from the 70s and 80s that I've heard they have to "bake" for each play to counteract the (literally and figuratively) sticky issues.

That's kind of correct ...

"Sticky-shed" only applies to backcoated tape, which was not manufactured until 1969. So it's not applicable in any case to the Pet Sounds tapes above.

The binder used on backcoated tapes from 1969 to about 1974 used whale oil, which is stable ... then they switched to a synthetic binder (due to environmental/poiltical pressures), which deteriorated over time. Though I'm not entirely sure that was the real problem, as Scotch 206 tape (for instance) was still stable even using a synthetic binder.

There are different sets of potential problems on the Beach Boys tapes above.

The tape types appear to be Scotch 201, 202, 203, and 111.

111 and 201 are acetate-based, which can easily break as it does not stretch. 201 can exhibit a sticky-shed like problem which is not true sticky shed, and the tapes cannot be baked (this will dry out the already brittle acetate base ... very bad). 111 doesn't have this problem, but can fall victim to a form of degradation known as "vinegar syndrome", of which little info is known except that it stinks and can pose health risks to those who inhale the fumes. They usually play okay (for now, who knows what will happen down the line). Vinegar syndrome is actually contagious (not making this up!) and can spread among tapes stored in close proximity of one another ... though only acetate tapes are susceptible.

202 and 203 have a plastic base, so they are less brittle and will not suffer from vinegar problems. But as they dry out over time the oxide (where the music is) itself can flake off very easily, leaving a strip of thin plastic that looks like “Scotch (adhesive) Tape”. This is very common (every reel I’ve ever seen exhibits “blank” spots at stress points like the beginning and end of the tape), and these tapes need to be treated with great care, especially where splices exist (if an old splice comes off - highly likely during play -, the oxide/music probably comes off along with it, so it should possibly be spliced back in with original splicing tape/oxide put back in place).
Thanks, HeyJude and DonnyL!

Great info, outstanding even - I was asking for similar reasons to shane's note: 16mm films that now smell like a bag of hot chips.

cheers - A

Save the Whales!
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« Reply #51 on: February 27, 2016, 04:37:22 PM »

yeah 'Save the Whales'.  it's quite tragic what we have done to them over the years,
slowly they are repopulating, which is great news.
In saying that, some people love the smell of a new car.
I love the smell of old reel to reel tape. 
Yes I'm weird, that's why I'm here  LOL
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