What is the most devastating moment in the band's career?

[Cam Mott]

Wait a sec...did two posters get married? Why wasn't I invited?  

Sounds like filledeplage is not that into me.

[Cam Mott]

Oh, I know! Let's steer this back on topic. The most devastating moment in the band's career... say, filledeplage... coughSTUDENTDEMONSTRATIONTIMEcoughcoughcough. There. All better and back on topic.

Nicko1234, you seriously think petty internet snipping at spelling and grammar somehow only applies to Cam Mott? C'mon. It's the beloved past-time of some of this board's greatest pedants with rich, near-Biblical beards. The weak complaints about personal attacks DO neatly change the subject from Mr. Love's boneheaded moves, tho. If you're really concerned about balance and protecting the integrity of Cam Mott's paper mache arguments, do feel free to post on topic and blame other members of the band for devastating moments so some weird equality is achieved in your minds.

There's a riot goin' on!

Did you have an opinion on the topic or are you just in it for the insults?

[SMiLE Brian]

 I think I'm gonna go put on a baseball cap and point at someone

I've often thought about going out on the street and doing this, maybe shouting out 'Wheeeeeeeeeeen!' as I do so, see how long it takes for the cops to show up.

please videotape this and wear ML circa 1992 clothes.

[Mike's Beard]

It would be a youtube sensation.

[Magic Transistor Radio]

The success of Endless Summer and Spirit of America to me is the most devastating moment in the Beach Boys career.

[Moon Dawg]

The success of Endless Summer and Spirit of America to me is the most devastating moment in the Beach Boys career.

  In a word, that is crazy. Trust me, as someone who was there, the success of these comps made The Beach Boys a superstar band again, this time with the younger set, a demographic that included me. ENDLESS SUMMER passed on the music to the next generation of fans.

  What was devastating was the band's reaction to this second generation success. They were given a golden opportunity to make contemporary recordings that built on the past, while being rooted in the present, that looked toward the future. We know that the right assembly of songs may have achieved this, but of course it didn't happen. That's down to The Beach Boys, not the wonderful success of ENDLESS SUMMER and SPIRIT OF AMERICA. Seriously, there was nothing "devastating" when these two comps resonated throughout the world 1974-76 - it was all pretty cool.

 

[Moon Dawg]

  The most devastating moment in the band's career, professionally and spiritually (to Brian at least) was obviously the collapse of SMiLE.

  I can't speak for the guys, but the deaths of Dennis and Carl were likely the most devastating personal setbacks.

[Douchepool]

Yeah, calling Endless Summer and Spirit of America "devastating" is a reach. Maybe devastatingly awesome for the band, though. Who's gonna argue with packed houses in stadiums all over the world as opposed to college campuses and small halls?

[guitarfool2002]

Endless Summer and Spirit of America can also be pegged to fortunate timing - In 1974 and up to maybe 1977 after disco replaced it, there was a full-blown revival of 50's and early 60's music and culture in general, across America at least. Did it start with George Lucas and American Graffitti? Perhaps it did, also maybe fueled by a combination of a post-60's lingering hangover and the Watergate era, but it seemed like a chunk of popular culture was focusing on the "Fabulous 50's" and the music started to sell again. The Beatles had a similar revival in 76-77 driven by reunion rumors and numerous repackaging and re-releases of Beatles songs and singles by Capitol. Happy Days after its first seasons - inspired some would say by American Graffitti's popularity and theme - became a national cultural phenom, full of 50's records just like Lucas did in his film. There was a desire to return to that era, and kids once again ate it up for a brief period.

Repackages of Beach Boys classics at this exact time just seemed to fit in perfectly with everything else that was going on, then factor in the "Spirit Of '76" vibe that was happening for the Bi-Centennial celebrations in the US, and the timing was right.

I don't think calling these hits packages "Endless Summer" or "Spirit Of America" instead of Greatest Hits vols. 3 and 4 or whatever was a stroke of marketing genius or devastation for the band (although Spirit Of America was a more direct appeal to a certain mindset of the era when it appeared), I just think these repackages hit the stores at just the right time given the way things were going in the 50's pop culture revival during those years. And it did remind people of how great these records made by a young producer/writer/arranger who could only hear out of one ear, his brothers, cousin, and high school friend and various other musicians still sounded a decade later. The records themselves were and are timeless, releasing them in the mid 70's was just a fluke of good timing and great luck since people were hungry for it.

[Robbie Mac]

Yeah, calling Endless Summer and Spirit of America "devastating" is a reach. Maybe devastatingly awesome for the band, though. Who's gonna argue with packed houses in stadiums all over the world as opposed to college campuses and small halls?

All of that came with a price.

Oh wait, only a guy like Mike Love would see nothing wrong with that.

[Douchepool]

A price, perhaps...but to call it devastating? Nah, not really. I fail to see how Michael would have anything to do with that. Care to elaborate?

[lostbeachboy]

I find Wipe Out with the Fat Boys pretty devastating...

[Camus]

I'm gonna rank the instance where Denny essentially got told he couldn't tour for his solo album and then return to the Beach Boys, without losing his job within the Beach Boys, as pretty high up there in devastating moments with plenty of wide-ranging (and granted, some speculative) repercussions.  Awful, awful move by his bandmates.

Especially galling as Mike Love then went on and did Celebration.

[JK]

I find Wipe Out with the Fat Boys pretty devastating...

With the emphasis on vast...

[Sheriff John Stone]

I'm gonna rank the instance where Denny essentially got told he couldn't tour for his solo album and then return to the Beach Boys, without losing his job within the Beach Boys, as pretty high up there in devastating moments with plenty of wide-ranging (and granted, some speculative) repercussions.  Awful, awful move by his bandmates.

Especially galling as Mike Love then went on and did Celebration.

And, Carl Wilson then went on and did two solo albums and some solo shows. And, Brian Wilson then went on and did solo shows in the mid-1980's and a solo album in 1988. Was that "galling" too?

[Cam Mott]

According to Mike the band wasn't consulted at all about ES, it was already decided by Capitol just shown to them. They weren't even consulting about a title, it was just a suggestion that he made.

[Bill30022]

According to Mike, "Endless Summer" is "Mike Love concept album".

[Mujan, 8@$+@Rc| of a Blue Wizard]

Not booting myKe luHv out of the group in the late 60's. His days in the sun were over by then. 

Ya know, while it may be a controversial opinion, I non-sarcastically and honestly do think that that more than one BB member might in fact agree with that.

I definitely think he did more harm than good post-67 or so.

For my answer...not finishing SMiLE. Hands down. Whether it took another month or 6 months, whether it would still have been the album Brian originally envisioned, whether it had been a #1 hit or a flop...the other guys should have sat Brian down and forced him to either divulge his grand plan or admit he didnt have one. And then they should have all worked together round the clock to record the missing vocals, finish either the elements or Tones to fill in the missing space on the album, and get SOMETHING out under the SMiLE name.

There's been other bad moments, but this is when their reputation really sank. I love Smiley Smile, and Id hope something done in that style could still be released in this alternate timeline, but it just wasnt what the public wanted in place of the much hyped psychedelic followup to Good Vibes and Pet Sounds. Had it come out after SMiLE rather than in place of it, I think it would have been seen as Brian intentionally going against the trends. As a willful act of defiance to the production race he himself started and perfected, instead of a band of has-beens out of touch with the times, which is how it came off in real life.

[Mujan, 8@$+@Rc| of a Blue Wizard]

Mikie mentioned Darlin'.  GREAT tune.  But...that was 11 months after Good Vibrations wrapped up it's stay on the Top 40...and it WASN'T the next logical progression.  The Wild Honey songs you mentioned are great tunes. 

And nobody here mentioned it, Lee. Howie is hung up on the Monkees and Turtles (justifiably so) but Darlin' was no slouch! It was a contenda!

The thing that kills me (and the band) was the release of the "Gettin' Hungry/Devoted To You" single after "Heroes & Villains". What the hell were they thinking?! If there was ever a singles momentum killer it was that one. Not only was Smiley Smile the momentum killer album in '67, "Gettin' Hungry" helped the band start into a downward spiral. Then the Darlin' and Wild Honey singles, but the damage was already done until Do It Again came along. Album Rock was already in vogue in 'late '67 and '68 anyway. Bad choices all around.

The secondary question to the WTF moment of that  "Gettin' Hungry/Devoted To You" single being released after "Heroes & Villains", is why it was credited as "Brian and Mike"? There had to be reason(s) for that.

I think it was Mike trying to undo what Brian did by crediting Caroline No to himself. I think Brian was testing the waters to see how successful he could be going solo, at least here and there. And Mike and the others beat him down and reinforced the fact that he was a beach boy, he had to keep making "beach boy music" and then the Brian + Mike credit was like a statement to the record buying public. "Brian going solo? No. He just put his name on that single because he wrote it. But WE wrote this one again. So it's credited to us. See. We do that sometimes. See."

Perhaps, since the Caroline No single didnt do quite so well comparitevly, it was a reaffirmation to the fans that they were back to using the "winning formula" of Brian and Mike?

[CenturyDeprived]

Mikie mentioned Darlin'.  GREAT tune.  But...that was 11 months after Good Vibrations wrapped up it's stay on the Top 40...and it WASN'T the next logical progression.  The Wild Honey songs you mentioned are great tunes.  

And nobody here mentioned it, Lee. Howie is hung up on the Monkees and Turtles (justifiably so) but Darlin' was no slouch! It was a contenda!

The thing that kills me (and the band) was the release of the "Gettin' Hungry/Devoted To You" single after "Heroes & Villains". What the hell were they thinking?! If there was ever a singles momentum killer it was that one. Not only was Smiley Smile the momentum killer album in '67, "Gettin' Hungry" helped the band start into a downward spiral. Then the Darlin' and Wild Honey singles, but the damage was already done until Do It Again came along. Album Rock was already in vogue in 'late '67 and '68 anyway. Bad choices all around.

The secondary question to the WTF moment of that  "Gettin' Hungry/Devoted To You" single being released after "Heroes & Villains", is why it was credited as "Brian and Mike"? There had to be reason(s) for that.

I think it was Mike trying to undo what Brian did by crediting Caroline No to himself. I think Brian was testing the waters to see how successful he could be going solo, at least here and there. And Mike and the others beat him down and reinforced the fact that he was a beach boy, he had to keep making "beach boy music" and then the Brian + Mike credit was like a statement to the record buying public. "Brian going solo? No. He just put his name on that single because he wrote it. But WE wrote this one again. So it's credited to us. See. We do that sometimes. See."

Perhaps, since the Caroline No single didnt do quite so well comparitevly, it was a reaffirmation to the fans that they were back to using the "winning formula" of Brian and Mike?

I would be quite surprised if the true answer deviated significantly from what you've theorized. It was a "CONTROL + Z" undo type of situation for the individuality that Brian had been building towards just one year prior.

Brian sure picked a real winner of a track to get that unique GH crediting distinction