Do any ardent Murry or Landy defenders exist?

[37!ws]

Some of you may have been around in the Beach Boys Internet world long enough to remember many years ago that someone happened to know the Wilson family's attorney, who agreed to answer questions from the fans. What was said even in that e-interview did reveal some not-terribly-horrible stuff about Landy. But some bits that I remember from the Q&A:

- Regarding Wouldn't It Be Nice: "[Landy] wrote the whole thing."
- Regarding rumors of Landy's homosexual interest in Brian: something like "We've heard those rumors, but we don't believe them to be true."
- Regarding Landdy's intentions: the attorney said they believed that in the beginning Landy had good intentions in the beginning. (The implication was that the control and $$$ came later on.)

And just like with Murry, Brian has said different things. Sometimes Brian is bitter about Murry and once said that the reason he's mostly deaf in his right ear is that Murry hit him in the head with a two-by-four. Sometimes Brian is bitter about Landy and at least once simply referred to him as "that guy." Other times Brian remembers Murry fondly. "He was my hero." He worked his ass off for the Beach Boys.  (And Brian also has said no, his bad ear isn't a result of Murry; he was born that way. Or someone accidentally hit him in the head with a board.) When Landy died Brian said he was "devastated" by the news. Lately he seems to have been more positive about Landy.

And no matter what, the fact is...Landy did save Brian's life, like it or not. He was the only person out there who actually could get Brian away from the drugs, the overeating, and what have you. No other shrink, hospital, whatever...could do that.

Going back to what I said about Landy's initial intentions versus what he eventually did...read The Wilson Project; I think even the recent reissue is once again out of print but you can still find copies online...but it is interesting about how in the beginning of the book when Gary Usher was first approached to collaborate on Brian's first solo album, it seemed that Landy was kind of scrutinizing Usher to make sure that he wasn't out to hurt Brian, but by the end of the book -- which covers about a couple of years later -- it's clear that Landy was all about the money and not much else.

[Mike's Beard]

Question for longtime BB fans: Did alarm bells go off with any of you when you first saw Brian's doctor was receiving co-write credits on songs?

[rn57]

bgas brings up an interesting point. By 1988, the California Board of Medical Quality Assurance, which issued and supervised licenses for professionals, was investigating Landy and not just regarding his association with Brian. If he was making people who worked him sign nondisclosure agreements, then if those agreements could be viewed as having been deliberately used to impede such an investigation, that would be reason enough to revoke his license.  

One reason why I wonder if this Coombes fellow could recall what the wording was.  Of course, it's also interesting to find someone who once served on the Landy team who is willing to say that two months with the doctor was two months too many. We've had very little in the way of firsthand accounts from the people who worked under Landy about what he was doing to Brian, no doubt partly due to nondisclosure agreeements and such.  I remember a while ago an SS'er was trying to track down Kevin Leslie and Evan Landy, but apparently without a reply, and on several threads here what Alexandra Morgan has had to say, ie not much of significance, has been discussed.

[rn57]

https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1144&dat=19711104&id=NawpAAAAIBAJ&sjid=mlAEAAAAIBAJ&pg=7272,1287935&hl=en

It probably doesn't need its own thread, so might as well toss it on here.  Above, an interview with Landy published in a Pittsburgh paper in '71 when he wrote The Underground Dictionary.  It differs in some significant ways from his standard biographical info.

For one thing, it's stated here that he dropped out of school not in the sixth grade, which would have been in the mid-1940s, but, he says, from high school "about 1950" when he was 15 or 16, that is, as a sophomore or maybe a freshman.

It is stated in the article that his problem in getting through school was "a hyperkinetic condition" caused by "brain chemistry" - which would be a diagonosis of ADD. Which is different from dyslexia, though since he says he spelled "at about a third grade level" before he went back to school, dyslexia probably factored in too. The article states that the condition was medically brought under control - presumably via Ritalin which was, at the time this was published, practically the only drug used for ADD. If Landy was indeed Ritalin dependent, it would explain to no small degree why he was as comfortable with overmedicating Brian as he was.

[Lee Marshall]

Question for longtime BB fans: Did alarm bells go off with any of you when you first saw Brian's doctor was receiving co-write credits on songs?

WTF?  And "ya sure!!!" were approximately my reactions...although it was good to see Brian composing and recording again so I, for one, just let it pass like water off a duck's back.  That was phase one again.  Landy likely wrote almost or exactly nothing.

[Lonely Summer]

Question for longtime BB fans: Did alarm bells go off with any of you when you first saw Brian's doctor was receiving co-write credits on songs?

WTF?  And "ya sure!!!" were approximately my reactions...although it was good to see Brian composing and recording again so I, for one, just let it pass like water off a duck's back.  That was phase one again.  Landy likely wrote almost or exactly nothing.

Right. I was so happy to have an album from Brian, that I tried to write off any doubts about Landy. Still, I kept having those nagging thoughts.

[Douchepool]

I'd argue that Murry had his place in lighting a fire under Brian and helping get the band signed to Capitol...but after a year or so the band was light years beyond him and his influence. On the topic of Landy, love the guy or hate him, had Marilyn and Carl NOT intervened to get Brian some help Brian might not have survived past the early 80s.

[Pretty Funky]

Landy definitely saved Brian's life, much like Hitler built great roads.

[Douchepool]

Apples and oranges.

[Sound of Free]

It seems really odd to me that abused children have a tendency to abuse their own children, but for whatever reason, that's the case. I wish Murry had been the one to break the cycle in the Wilson family, but he probably deserves at least a little sympathy for the rough life he had.

Landy gets no pass from me. In addition to everything that have been mentioned in the thread, does anyone else remember the bizarre story of Landy and "Eve of Destruction"?

http://www.goldminemag.com/article/perception-reality-singer-songwriter-p-f-sloan

[bgas]

It seems really odd to me that abused children have a tendency to abuse their own children, but for whatever reason, that's the case. I wish Murry had been the one to break the cycle in the Wilson family, but he probably deserves at least a little sympathy for the rough life he had.

Landy gets no pass from me. In addition to everything that have been mentioned in the thread, does anyone else remember the bizarre story of Landy and "Eve of Destruction"?

http://www.goldminemag.com/article/perception-reality-singer-songwriter-p-f-sloan

Oh, HA! wait a minute. You must have meant the bizarre story of PFSloan and Eve Of Destruction.
PF's mind, it is exploding....

[ChicagoAnn]

This is my first actual post here, except for my intro on the New Members.

I met Evan Landy briefly in the late 90s through a mutual friend. This was some time after the Surf Nazi period. He was a very nice guy with a wonderful wife. At the time, I had a vague notion about Eugene Landy but didn't think much about it. What I did learn is that Landy-father was no less a control freak mind-fcuker with his own child than he was with Brian Wilson. When Evan was a teen, if he gained more than a couple of pounds he was sent off to rehab. If Eugene Landy did what he did to Brian, imagine what it was like to be his child.

My friend met Eugene Landy and described him as a guy with dyed hair wearing a sparkly track suit. Very friendly. Very slick. 

My vote goes to Landy as the worst, as he was exploitative without the love.  I think Murry did love Brian and recognized his talent, but Murry's great narcissism, insecurity, and his own abusive childhood superseded his love--a love I think was there.

PS. I've edited this because I realized that some info is unsubstantiated.

[joshferrell]

This is my first actual post here, except for my intro on the New Members.

I met Evan Landy briefly in the late 90s through a mutual friend. This was some time after the Surf Nazi period. He was a very nice guy with a wonderful wife. At the time, I had a vague notion about Eugene Landy but didn't think much about it. What I did learn is that Landy-father was no less a control freak mind-fcuker with his own child than he was with Brian Wilson. When Evan was a teen, if he gained more than a couple of pounds he was sent off to rehab. If Eugene Landy did what he did to Brian, imagine what it was like to be his child.

My friend met Eugene Landy and described him as a guy with dyed hair wearing a sparkly track suit. Very friendly. Very slick.  

My vote goes to Landy as the worst, as he was exploitative without the love.  I think Murry did love Brian and recognized his talent, but Murry's great narcissism, insecurity, and his own abusive childhood superseded his love--a love I think was there.

PS. I've edited this because I realized that some info is unsubstantiated.

so basically he was like a car salesman...lol

[joshferrell]

c'mon..Murry was way better than Landy,,,at least he had an album (the many moods of Murry Wilson) and didn't have to steal other peoples music..

[CenturyDeprived]

c'mon..Murry was way better than Landy,,,at least he had an album (the many moods of Murry Wilson) and didn't have to steal other peoples music..

Shudder...  I almost think that Landy might have tried to do an album of his own, produced by Brian, if he could have finagled it. The horror...

[joshferrell]

c'mon..Murry was way better than Landy,,,at least he had an album (the many moods of Murry Wilson) and didn't have to steal other peoples music..

Shudder...  I almost think that Landy might have tried to do an album of his own, produced by Brian, if he could have finagled it. The horror...

"Sweet Psychiatrist." would be the perfect name for it,,,,

[Douchepool]

c'mon..Murry was way better than Landy,,,at least he had an album (the many moods of Murry Wilson) and didn't have to steal other peoples music..

Shudder...  I almost think that Landy might have tried to do an album of his own, produced by Brian, if he could have finagled it. The horror...

He did; it's called Sweet Insanity.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

This is my first actual post here, except for my intro on the New Members.

I met Evan Landy briefly in the late 90s through a mutual friend. This was some time after the Surf Nazi period. He was a very nice guy with a wonderful wife. At the time, I had a vague notion about Eugene Landy but didn't think much about it. What I did learn is that Landy-father was no less a control freak mind-fcuker with his own child than he was with Brian Wilson. When Evan was a teen, if he gained more than a couple of pounds he was sent off to rehab. If Eugene Landy did what he did to Brian, imagine what it was like to be his child.

My friend met Eugene Landy and described him as a guy with dyed hair wearing a sparkly track suit. Very friendly. Very slick.  

My vote goes to Landy as the worst, as he was exploitative without the love.  I think Murry did love Brian and recognized his talent, but Murry's great narcissism, insecurity, and his own abusive childhood superseded his love--a love I think was there.

PS. I've edited this because I realized that some info is unsubstantiated.

Thanks for posting that.  

[37!ws]

BTW, May Pang's book Loving John has a dedication to Landy...a very syrupy dedication. Anybody know what that was about??

[Mikie]

I think Henry Edwards, who was May's co-author, was the one who thanked Landy. I think Landy was a friend of Edwards.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Back in the 80s, someone (who I won't name, but you'd know them) said to me with a completely straight face, "if you love Brian, you have to love Gene too".

[Douchepool]

Back in the 80s, someone (who I won't name, but you'd know them) said to me with a completely straight face, "if you love Brian, you have to love Gene too".

That's very disturbing.

[donald]

there was a time when many of us who were adults at the time and long time BW fans, thought it was great that some mental health guy had gotten Brian Wilson out of bed, got him jogging, had him back to writing songs.    but I would say, as someone mentioned, that many of us had mixed feelings when BW88 surfaced with so much credit going to Landy.  then the rest was revealed and we now have the bigger picture of what happened:    a guy with a psychology degree who had credentials and worked alongside respected and noted psychologists at the University Of Hawaii,   Got into a highly unethical dual relationship with a famous client.   everyone in the field knows above all to NEVER enter into a dual relationship and to seek peer input if there is any doubt about the possibility of such a relationship developing.   Landy deliberately went full steam ahead into such a relationship.    guilty on all counts.

Murry Wilson was Dad warts and all.    and Dads, often have dual relationships with sons, especially in a family business such as your children being entertainers.    Mommy dearest maybe.  but not criminal abuse within a professional therapeutic relationship.      BTW,    Who here has had a perfect relationship with  his or her dad?

[Andrew G. Doe]

there was a time when many of us who were adults at the time and long time BW fans, thought it was great that some mental health guy had gotten Brian Wilson out of bed, got him jogging, had him back to writing songs.    but I would say, as someone mentioned, that many of us had mixed feelings when BW88 surfaced with so much credit going to Landy.  then the rest was revealed and we now have the bigger picture of what happened:    a guy with a psychology degree who had credentials and worked alongside respected and noted psychologists at the University Of Hawaii,   Got into a highly unethical dual relationship with a famous client.   everyone in the field knows above all to NEVER enter into a dual relationship and to seek peer input if there is any doubt about the possibility of such a relationship developing.   Landy deliberately went full steam ahead into such a relationship.    guilty on all counts.

Murry Wilson was Dad warts and all.    and Dads, often have dual relationships with sons, especially in a family business such as your children being entertainers.    Mommy dearest maybe.  but not criminal abuse within a professional therapeutic relationship.      BTW,    Who here has had a perfect relationship with  his or her dad?

Jesus ?  

Seriously, like everyone else back in the early 80s I was thrilled to see Brian pulled back from an obvious precipice, and (also like everyone else) soon increasingly concerned at how Landy was infiltrating every aspect of Brian's life. The 1985 Musician article gave the spider senses a good workout and thereafter it only got worse. I only met the man once, at the legendary 1988 Stomp convention in London when Brian turned up, played three songs and signed something for all 350 attendees. The word that instantly sprang to mind was "odious", closely followed by "ingratiating", "smarmy" and "untrustworthy". God bless everyone who was instrumental in freeing Brian from this leeche's grasp, those known and unknown.

[Jay]

If you want an example of landy's behavior with other patients, read "Here's The Story" by Maureen Mccormick. It's quite disturbing, to say the least.