an alternate timeline where Mike Love is on top of the world...

[Micha]

It is very much an open question in my mind what role Mike Love played in the composition of the Beach Boys Today. On stylistic grounds, I'm confident that Mike made a major contribution to Kiss Me Baby, and that he contributed relatively little to In the Back of My Mind. But for some of the other songs I think it's hard to say. But there is no doubt in my mind that the same balance of composing could have been applied to Pet Sounds, because Today has a similar level of lyrical sophistication. But Brian needed Tony Asher as more than a lyricist, he was also a friend, someone to hang out with, talk things through with, bounce ideas off of. It was a time-consuming process, and Mike was in Japan with the Beach Boys. Pet Sounds wasn't the kind of thing you could get done in back rooms and cabs between gigs, so for Mike to work on the project, the band would have had to take a break from touring. So it would have meant changes in the Beach Boys methods and course beyond just switching lyricists.

As for Smile, I think it is no diss on Mike Love to say that Mike's talents and interests were fundamentally incompatible with Smile as Brian and conceived it on a fundamental level. Smile with Mike Love lyrics wouldn't have been Smile, it would have had to be something completely different.

Great post! Especially the part about the Beach Boys having to stop touring for quite a while to get Mike to work on a project of that ambitious scale makes total sense. If you take into account how different their personalities are and what Tony Asher and Van Dyke Parks reported what the writing sessions with Brian were like, Brian would have probably driven Mike nuts with his behavior. Mike wouldn't have understood why Brian behaved that way.

I think though that had Mike collaborated with Brian for SMiLE, the result would have matched the positive title actually more than it does now. IMHO the title "Dumb Angel" fit Brian's and Van Dyke's collaborations way more than "SMiLE".

And Mike could do more sensitive lyrics if he was asked to, there's many examples. IMHO Mike could have done better lyrics for DYLW and Wonderful than Van Dyke, and equally as good ones for Cabin Essence. The one thing that Mike could never have done is Surf's Up.

Would SMiLE have been finished in 1967 if Mike had done the lyrics? I doubt it, as Brian's mental state was the main obstacle to that.

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

It is very much an open question in my mind what role Mike Love played in the composition of the Beach Boys Today. On stylistic grounds, I'm confident that Mike made a major contribution to Kiss Me Baby, and that he contributed relatively little to In the Back of My Mind. But for some of the other songs I think it's hard to say. But there is no doubt in my mind that the same balance of composing could have been applied to Pet Sounds, because Today has a similar level of lyrical sophistication. But Brian needed Tony Asher as more than a lyricist, he was also a friend, someone to hang out with, talk things through with, bounce ideas off of. It was a time-consuming process, and Mike was in Japan with the Beach Boys. Pet Sounds wasn't the kind of thing you could get done in back rooms and cabs between gigs, so for Mike to work on the project, the band would have had to take a break from touring. So it would have meant changes in the Beach Boys methods and course beyond just switching lyricists.

As for Smile, I think it is no diss on Mike Love to say that Mike's talents and interests were fundamentally incompatible with Smile as Brian and conceived it on a fundamental level. Smile with Mike Love lyrics wouldn't have been Smile, it would have had to be something completely different.

Great post! Especially the part about the Beach Boys having to stop touring for quite a while to get Mike to work on a project of that ambitious scale makes total sense. If you take into account how different their personalities are and what Tony Asher and Van Dyke Parks reported what the writing sessions with Brian were like, Brian would have probably driven Mike nuts with his behavior. Mike wouldn't have understood why Brian behaved that way.

I think though that had Mike collaborated with Brian for SMiLE, the result would have matched the positive title actually more than it does now. IMHO the title "Dumb Angel" fit Brian's and Van Dyke's collaborations way more than "SMiLE".

And Mike could do more sensitive lyrics if he was asked to, there's many examples. IMHO Mike could have done better lyrics for DYLW and Wonderful than Van Dyke, and equally as good ones for Cabin Essence. The one thing that Mike could never have done is Surf's Up.

Would SMiLE have been finished in 1967 if Mike had done the lyrics? I doubt it, as Brian's mental state was the main obstacle to that.

You got that right!

Surf's Up is pure lyrical genius! No one but VDP would have done THAT!

[Mujan, 8@$+@Rc| of a Blue Wizard]

It is very much an open question in my mind what role Mike Love played in the composition of the Beach Boys Today. On stylistic grounds, I'm confident that Mike made a major contribution to Kiss Me Baby, and that he contributed relatively little to In the Back of My Mind. But for some of the other songs I think it's hard to say. But there is no doubt in my mind that the same balance of composing could have been applied to Pet Sounds, because Today has a similar level of lyrical sophistication. But Brian needed Tony Asher as more than a lyricist, he was also a friend, someone to hang out with, talk things through with, bounce ideas off of. It was a time-consuming process, and Mike was in Japan with the Beach Boys. Pet Sounds wasn't the kind of thing you could get done in back rooms and cabs between gigs, so for Mike to work on the project, the band would have had to take a break from touring. So it would have meant changes in the Beach Boys methods and course beyond just switching lyricists.

As for Smile, I think it is no diss on Mike Love to say that Mike's talents and interests were fundamentally incompatible with Smile as Brian and conceived it on a fundamental level. Smile with Mike Love lyrics wouldn't have been Smile, it would have had to be something completely different.

Great post! Especially the part about the Beach Boys having to stop touring for quite a while to get Mike to work on a project of that ambitious scale makes total sense. If you take into account how different their personalities are and what Tony Asher and Van Dyke Parks reported what the writing sessions with Brian were like, Brian would have probably driven Mike nuts with his behavior. Mike wouldn't have understood why Brian behaved that way.

I think though that had Mike collaborated with Brian for SMiLE, the result would have matched the positive title actually more than it does now. IMHO the title "Dumb Angel" fit Brian's and Van Dyke's collaborations way more than "SMiLE".

And Mike could do more sensitive lyrics if he was asked to, there's many examples. IMHO Mike could have done better lyrics for DYLW and Wonderful than Van Dyke, and equally as good ones for Cabin Essence. The one thing that Mike could never have done is Surf's Up.

Would SMiLE have been finished in 1967 if Mike had done the lyrics? I doubt it, as Brian's mental state was the main obstacle to that.

I actually disagree with the idea that Mike could write better lyrics for Worms and CE. Wonderful, maybe. And yeah, there would've been no Surfs Up, that's for sure. I think perhaps SMiLE would've been just as melancholy for the Childhood songs but probably more patriotic and fun for the Americana songs.

Dumb Angel was a great name, but SMiLE fits too. It's sort of a statement that appearances are deceiving. Behind the simplistic cover and happy, unassuming title is some of the most complex pop arrangements of all time with a dose of angst (child sections) and fear (Fire.) It also ties in with Tim Leary's S.M.I^2.L.E. philosophy, intentionally or not, and both were inspired by and a celebration of mind expansion through psychedelics.

[Lonely Summer]

The stereotype we have in mind of a Mike Love lyric really wasn't true in the 60's. It's something that came to the fore after the success of Endless Summer. There was nothing wrong with the lyrics Mike was writing for the Beach Boys songs in the 60's. I don't really see any problem with them until the Surf's Up album. Reilly told them they needed to get relevant...so we got the preachy lyrics of Don't Go Near the Water and Student Demonstration Time. Mike had a few good lyrics after that - Only With You comes to mind - but by and large, he was on the road to self parody.

[Micha]

I actually disagree with the idea that Mike could write better lyrics for Worms and CE. Wonderful, maybe.

Well, that's OK with me. DYLW has - IMHO - really bad lyrics, that's why I think Mike's would have been better, and I said "equally as good" lyrics for CE, not better ones (nitpickingly said).