Is A New Beach Boys Album On The Way?

[rab2591]

What is sad is this thread persisted on the top for this long...

Whoops just bumped it again, dam. 

the most favoritest thread of the moment for so many!

Four pages of speculation about Brian's nonattendance at the Ella Awards in a thread titled Is A New Beach Boys Album On The Way? with a bonus spat between Smile Brian and Dancing Bear...add a petition to the mix and we've got another average day on Smiley Smile

[Dancing Bear]

As far as I'm concerned, and as long as I don't hammer my opinion down everyone's throat every day, week or month, I can, oh yeah I'm sure I can state an opinion about any Beach Boy. And I will.

Now if you guys think I don't deserve to be called a fan, it's ok with me. I'll survive.  

[SMiLE Brian]

[Niko]

What an awful movie.

[Dancing Bear]

I guess Smile Brian has got a genious follow-up to the answer that he's demanding from me. Right in his pocket.

Just like Smile... Shelved. 

[Andrew G. Doe]

As far as I'm concerned, and as long as I don't hammer my opinion down everyone's throat every day, week or month, I can, oh yeah I'm sure I can state an opinion about any Beach Boy. And I will.

Now if you guys think I don't deserve to be called a fan, it's ok with me. I'll survive.  

Stating opinions is fine. Stating something you can't possibly have the first idea about as fact isn't.

[donald]

Why would he need to do that? . I don't see much Mike publicity outside of the Ella Award thing.

Been seeing a lot of interviews, media pieces, and the appearances on the car shows etc.  Just seems there is a lot of Mike out there recently.  No judgment from me, just observation and speculation.

[Dancing Bear]

As far as I'm concerned, and as long as I don't hammer my opinion down everyone's throat every day, week or month, I can, oh yeah I'm sure I can state an opinion about any Beach Boy. And I will.

Now if you guys think I don't deserve to be called a fan, it's ok with me. I'll survive.  

Stating opinions is fine. Stating something you can't possibly have the first idea about as fact isn't.

ok, I can live with that.

Just a note: not having the first idea about the Beach Boys as real people never stopped 99,5% of us of writing trash about them.

[SMiLE Brian]

Why would he need to do that? . I don't see much Mike publicity outside of the Ella Award thing.

Been seeing a lot of interviews, media pieces, and the appearances on the car shows etc.  Just seems there is a lot of Mike out there recently.  No judgment from me, just observation and speculation.

Yeah I think Mike is trying to drum up interest for a solo music release.

[Shady]

Why would he need to do that? . I don't see much Mike publicity outside of the Ella Award thing.

Been seeing a lot of interviews, media pieces, and the appearances on the car shows etc.  Just seems there is a lot of Mike out there recently.  No judgment from me, just observation and speculation.

Money...

[Mike's Beard]

Maybe Brian realised that showing up with everybody else might raise expectations for another BB reunion project, something that he's not ready to address yet with an upcoming solo album. It's nice to see Al there, relations with Mike can't be as strained as some of us thought.

[Pretty Funky]

To draw a line under this thread, Matt said his dad and 'others' were hoping to record in February for Brians album. Low and behold 4/5 of the C50 appear together.

End of the day, no harm done. No lives were lost.

Moving on! 

[Dancing Bear]

Maybe Brian realised that showing up with everybody else might raise expectations for another BB reunion project, something that he's not ready to address yet with an upcoming solo album. It's nice to see Al there, relations with Mike can't be as strained as some of us thought.

I think their relationship is better in person than when being interviewed about current Beach Boys' affairs. Not that it's good, but as you say, not that bad either.

[absinthe_boy]

With regards to the end of the C50 tour, as far as I remember it went something like this:

Everyone agreed to a tour of roughly 50 dates. Nobody knew how it would go, especially Brian who was unwell (back problems) early in the tour.

Mike seems to have persuaded Brian to add some 20-odd more dates, including the final two in the UK. Brian agreed to those "and no more" at a time when he wasn't feeling too good physically and likely everyone was wary of the whole situation even lasting to the end of those dates.

Amazingly, by the time of the final gigs everyone was still getting on with each other and still performing well. Really this went against all predictions. By now, Brian wanted the tour to continue. Indeed its possible that in some way everyone wanted to continue that line-up of The Beach Boys in some form or other...either continuing the C50 tour after a short break, continuing together full time or resting that line-up before bringing it back in, say, 2014.

But...some months earlier Brian had said "and no more". The Mike & Bruce show had already committed to dates, on the prior assumption that the agreement to end the "reunion" after the C50 tour would be honoured by all parties. This pee'd off Brian who said it felt like being fired etc. I really can't blame Mike, Bruce and their people for wanting to continue working after the C50 tour was completed.

Strikes me as a monumental misunderstanding, and I can genuinely see both sides.

AGD correct me please if I am wrong (it's been known).

As for why Brian didn't turn up at Mike's award, I have no idea.

[The Heartical Don]

With regards to the end of the C50 tour, as far as I remember it went something like this:

Everyone agreed to a tour of roughly 50 dates. Nobody knew how it would go, especially Brian who was unwell (back problems) early in the tour.

Mike seems to have persuaded Brian to add some 20-odd more dates, including the final two in the UK. Brian agreed to those "and no more" at a time when he wasn't feeling too good physically and likely everyone was wary of the whole situation even lasting to the end of those dates.

Amazingly, by the time of the final gigs everyone was still getting on with each other and still performing well. Really this went against all predictions. By now, Brian wanted the tour to continue. Indeed its possible that in some way everyone wanted to continue that line-up of The Beach Boys in some form or other...either continuing the C50 tour after a short break, continuing together full time or resting that line-up before bringing it back in, say, 2014.

But...some months earlier Brian had said "and no more". The Mike & Bruce show had already committed to dates, on the prior assumption that the agreement to end the "reunion" after the C50 tour would be honoured by all parties. This pee'd off Brian who said it felt like being fired etc. I really can't blame Mike, Bruce and their people for wanting to continue working after the C50 tour was completed.

Strikes me as a monumental misunderstanding, and I can genuinely see both sides.

AGD correct me please if I am wrong (it's been known).

As for why Brian didn't turn up at Mike's award, I have no idea.

Thank you for the lucid exposé, A-Boy -

of course I don't know anything factual about those goings-on, I only know what I read about it, in various and different accounts.

But this is by far the most coherent and credible story; with an inner logic, and respect for all involved.

Lesson: they, and we, are all human.

(Somehow I hope that your version will be supported and corroborated, so that I can forget the other ones with the acrimony and accusations, and bitterness (dissatisfaction? dissapointment?))

[Sheriff John Stone]

Indeed its possible that in some way everyone wanted to continue that line-up of The Beach Boys in some form or other...

In some form or other....Yeah, that was/is the question. But, what is the answer, if there is one? The wild card again, as always, is Brian Wilson. It has been speculated that Brian wanted to continue as a Beach Boy. But, under what or who's conditions? His, Mike's, the group's?

Brian wanted to continue touring with The Beach Boys? For how many shows? Just speculating... Brian wants to perform 20-25 shows per year. Mike wants to perform 75-80 shows per year. Maybe Al and David would be up for 50 good ones. There's a big difference between 20 and 80. And, if Brian doesn't appear at all of the shows, there's going to be some problems. What's the answer? A compromise?

Brian wants to record another Beach Boys' album. He wants to choose his collaborator. Mike wants to choose Brian's collaborator - himself. Al, Bruce, and David would like to contribute more. The record company or whoever is funding the project wants their say. A compromise?

Brian wants to be a Beach Boy again. Does that mean he's all in? TV appearances? Interviews? Promotions? Charity events? Will his situation be like 1985-present where he has a solo career AND a Beach Boys' role? A compromise?

Like some (a few?), I don't necessarily think that Brian wanted to continue as a Beach Boy - with the lengthy touring, recording/collaborating/associating with Mike, and either putting his solo career on hold or juggling both. In the Beach Boys' history, it always has and it always will come down to Brian's role. This is a very complicated situation. Clearly Brian and Mike are not on the same page. The C50 was a unique situation. There needs to be a lot of compromising for a future Beach Boys that includes Brian Wilson. A lot. 

[HeyJude]

With regards to the end of the C50 tour, as far as I remember it went something like this:

I'll offer my two cents here as well, and I will say up front that those who are "tired" of C50 talk, who burst into threads to chastise those for still discussing it (creating the weird paradox where their complaint becomes even less relevant than the stuff they're complaining about being posted), please just move on.

Everyone agreed to a tour of roughly 50 dates. Nobody knew how it would go, especially Brian who was unwell (back problems) early in the tour.

The first dates being agreed upon seems to be clear indeed; nobody has disputed that. I don’t think anything was strongly indicating to those involved that there was any serious possibility of those initial dates falling apart or anybody dropping out. For all the talk of how the tour could implode at any moment, I never gave any serious consideration to the possibility of the tour being cancelled or Brian or anybody dropping out mid-tour, simply due to the huge financial and contractual stakes involved. Brian’s back may have been a concern, but not particular more so than any general concerns about the guys, at least Brian-Mike-Al, getting along and getting through the tour. Apart from literally physically not being able to get on stage, Brian would have had to stick it out. Similarly, any other interpersonal issues, if they had arisen during the tour, would have had to be dealt with and they all would have pushed through.

Mike seems to have persuaded Brian to add some 20-odd more dates, including the final two in the UK. Brian agreed to those "and no more" at a time when he wasn't feeling too good physically and likely everyone was wary of the whole situation even lasting to the end of those dates.

Regarding adding the dates, I don’t see any evidence that it was Mike who specifically had to “convince” Brian to do the 20 or so extra dates. It sounds like the offer was made to the group, and they accepted. If anything, Mike’s own statements seem to suggest Mike was the one who was a bit hesitant about it, perhaps because he had already booked some Mike/Bruce shows and knew this would lead to “C50” shows butting right up against Mike/Bruce shows. Mike’s statements on the subject tend to read like he feels he was the one who went way above and beyond by agreeing to do more dates (conveniently avoiding addressing that this proved his “set end date” could be changed if he wanted to allow it). Regarding Brian saying “no more dates”, we have one comment in one Mike interview referring to Brian saying “no more dates”, and even in that story, Mike didn’t say precisely *when* Brian allegedly said this, nor under what circumstances. I continue to contend that, had Brian been the sole driving force behind there being “no more dates”, that big media blow-up near the end of the tour would have easily been avoided by Mike immediately saying it was Brian. Mike didn’t do this, and I suspect it was because this story simply isn’t what happened, and more to the point, Mike certainly wasn’t of the opinion of “I really wanted to do more reunion shows, but Brian stopped us.”

Amazingly, by the time of the final gigs everyone was still getting on with each other and still performing well. Really this went against all predictions. By now, Brian wanted the tour to continue. Indeed its possible that in some way everyone wanted to continue that line-up of The Beach Boys in some form or other...either continuing the C50 tour after a short break, continuing together full time or resting that line-up before bringing it back in, say, 2014.

This is where my take would diverge even more. Firstly, those are a lot of different scenarios you’re describing as all of them wanting to continue “in some form.” I think Mike’s own comments on the situation, coupled with what I’ve heard from even the most pro-Mike folks professing to be “in the know”, indicate that Mike did not want to continue the reunion. I think he was trying to be as diplomatic and polite as Mike Love is capable of being near the end of the tour when he invoked his “give it a rest for a few years” ill logic rather than just saying what he ended up saying any number of months later. It seems pretty clear Mike was unhappy with a number of things about the reunion, and kind of bit his lip as much as he could while he was contractually tied to the reunion. He clearly was lukewarm about how the album was recorded, he clearly didn’t like the humongous, expensive touring band and touring operation, he seems to have soured on Joe Thomas (who was still involved in every aspect of the group by that point, writing, producing, financing in the studio and on tour), and that’s not even getting into the constant references being made by “insiders” regarding the Love and Wilson wives being linchpins in the whole thing who may have ended up not seeing eye to eye either. I don’t think Mike left the reunion thinking there was zero chance of doing something together, but whether he was justified or not, it seems pretty clear he was done with the reunion after Wembley.

But...some months earlier Brian had said "and no more". The Mike & Bruce show had already committed to dates, on the prior assumption that the agreement to end the "reunion" after the C50 tour would be honoured by all parties. This pee'd off Brian who said it felt like being fired etc. I really can't blame Mike, Bruce and their people for wanting to continue working after the C50 tour was completed.

And this is where I would also diverge. We don’t know when or if Brian said “no more”, and this also (incorrectly in my opinion) implies that the only thing keeping Mike from doing more reunion activities was previously-booked Mike/Bruce shows. None of this washes to me, again regardless of whether Mike was justified in ending the reunion. I think Mike had soured on elements of the reunion involving money and power, and his level of comfort with the entire operation. If he had not booked a single Mike/Bruce show for the duration of 2012, I don’t think he would have extended the reunion. He was done. We also have to get back into the more broad question of whether Mike *had* to book more Mike/Bruce shows. Simply put, I don’t think he had to, and later using those booking as an excuse for not being able to do more reunion shows was totally bogus (and was an excuse Mike may have used initially, but he eventually conceded he didn’t like how the reunion business and interpersonal model was going; leaving only some fans to continue to use those bookings as a justification). Further, there is strong albeit circumstantial/anecdotal evidence that Mike could have cancelled/postponed/rescheduled/reconfigured any Mike/Bruce bookings if indeed those were the only thing standing in the way.

[clack]

With regards to the end of the C50 tour, as far as I remember it went something like this:

Everyone agreed to a tour of roughly 50 dates. Nobody knew how it would go, especially Brian who was unwell (back problems) early in the tour.

Mike seems to have persuaded Brian to add some 20-odd more dates, including the final two in the UK. Brian agreed to those "and no more" at a time when he wasn't feeling too good physically and likely everyone was wary of the whole situation even lasting to the end of those dates.

Amazingly, by the time of the final gigs everyone was still getting on with each other and still performing well. Really this went against all predictions. By now, Brian wanted the tour to continue. Indeed its possible that in some way everyone wanted to continue that line-up of The Beach Boys in some form or other...either continuing the C50 tour after a short break, continuing together full time or resting that line-up before bringing it back in, say, 2014.

But...some months earlier Brian had said "and no more". The Mike & Bruce show had already committed to dates, on the prior assumption that the agreement to end the "reunion" after the C50 tour would be honoured by all parties. This pee'd off Brian who said it felt like being fired etc. I really can't blame Mike, Bruce and their people for wanting to continue working after the C50 tour was completed.

Strikes me as a monumental misunderstanding, and I can genuinely see both sides.

AGD correct me please if I am wrong (it's been known).

As for why Brian didn't turn up at Mike's award, I have no idea.

This may be true -- but what does a 2012 tour (which would have long been over by now, anyway, even if it had been extended beyond the 70 dates) have to do with this current album?

1) Brian says he's done with solo projects, says he wants every lp from now on to be the Beach Boys
2) Mike says he'll only work with Brian if he and Brian co-write the songs from scratch (presumably without a 3rd party)
3) Brian starts work on a Beach Boys lp in-all-but-name, with Al, David, and Blondie, but without Mike (and Bruce)

Is there any other info out there?

[HeyJude]

This may be true -- but what does a 2012 tour (which would have long been over by now, anyway, even if it had been extended beyond the 70 dates) have to do with this current album?

1) Brian says he's done with solo projects, says he wants every lp from now on to be the Beach Boys
2) Mike says he'll only work with Brian if he and Brian co-write the songs from scratch (presumably without a 3rd party)
3) Brian starts work on a Beach Boys lp in-all-but-name, with Al, David, and Blondie, but without Mike (and Bruce)

Is there any other info out there?

I don’t think we know if any of the things in your list are even possibly true, apart from perhaps #2 to some degree. It seems Mike’s participation in another BB album is probably contingent on more collaboration, though we don’t know if that literally means the exclusion of anybody outside of Love/Wilson writing stuff. I would tend to think Mike is not suggesting nobody else can have a songwriting credit on a theoretical future BB album.  

[clack]

This may be true -- but what does a 2012 tour (which would have long been over by now, anyway, even if it had been extended beyond the 70 dates) have to do with this current album?

1) Brian says he's done with solo projects, says he wants every lp from now on to be the Beach Boys
2) Mike says he'll only work with Brian if he and Brian co-write the songs from scratch (presumably without a 3rd party)
3) Brian starts work on a Beach Boys lp in-all-but-name, with Al, David, and Blondie, but without Mike (and Bruce)

Is there any other info out there?

I don’t think we know if any of the things in your list are even possibly true, apart from perhaps #2 to some degree. It seems Mike’s participation in another BB album is probably contingent on more collaboration, though we don’t know if that literally means the exclusion of anybody outside of Love/Wilson writing stuff. I would tend to think Mike is not suggesting nobody else can have a songwriting credit on a theoretical future BB album.  

#1 is true. Brian did say it in an inteview. #3 is true. Brian is recording with Al, David, and Blondie.

[HeyJude]

This may be true -- but what does a 2012 tour (which would have long been over by now, anyway, even if it had been extended beyond the 70 dates) have to do with this current album?

1) Brian says he's done with solo projects, says he wants every lp from now on to be the Beach Boys
2) Mike says he'll only work with Brian if he and Brian co-write the songs from scratch (presumably without a 3rd party)
3) Brian starts work on a Beach Boys lp in-all-but-name, with Al, David, and Blondie, but without Mike (and Bruce)

Is there any other info out there?

I don’t think we know if any of the things in your list are even possibly true, apart from perhaps #2 to some degree. It seems Mike’s participation in another BB album is probably contingent on more collaboration, though we don’t know if that literally means the exclusion of anybody outside of Love/Wilson writing stuff. I would tend to think Mike is not suggesting nobody else can have a songwriting credit on a theoretical future BB album.  

#1 is true. Brian did say it in an inteview. #3 is true. Brian is recording with Al, David, and Blondie.

Brian has recently stated he's not going to do anymore solo projects? Is there a link to an interview where he stated this?

As for #3, "A Beach Boys album in all but name" is simply your characterization. You have no idea how prevalent Al or Dave would be on the album. Blondie being involved is awesome, but as he wasn't on the last Beach Boys album, I'm not sure his involvement means much as it pertains to a beach boys album.

[SMiLE Brian]

There are threads about BW working with Jeff Beck, blondie, and others on an unnamed solo project recently. Though it could morph into a BBs project.

[Jim V.]

Brian has recently stated he's not going to do anymore solo projects? Is there a link to an interview where he stated this?

I'm not clack, but I will say that I'm pretty sure I remember that Brian said he just wanted to do Beach Boys stuff from now on (or something like that) at the Rock 'n Roll Hall of Fame, when they had that get together thing right before they went to the UK (I think).

As for #3, "A Beach Boys album in all but name" is simply your characterization. You have no idea how prevalent Al or Dave would be on the album. Blondie being involved is awesome, but as he wasn't on the last Beach Boys album, I'm not sure his involvement means much as it pertains to a beach boys album.

I agree with you that none of us are sure how much Al, Blondie and Dave will be on the album. Therefore, we won't know if it truly will be a "Beach Boys album in all but name" or not. And let's be honest, since Dave likely isn't gonna sing much (if at all) it's really gonna come down to how much of Al and Blondie is on the album. If they are both on like three or more songs a piece, I think it'll become obvious that it's a little less "Brian solo" and a little more "Brian with his buds from The Beach Boys".

On the other hand, I don't think it's a coincidence that even though Brian lost two Beach Boys for this project (Mike and Bruce) he brings in one (Blondie). I mean, it is pretty awesome that there is likely gonna be FOUR Beach Boys on the new Brian album. The only other Brian album that had any other members was GIOMH, and let's just say that it wasn't quite up to Carl whether he was on that album or not by that point.

[sandmountainslim]

Mike and Brian can't agree on a touring Beach Boys that much has been clear for decades. 
How about they go back to the OLD way where Brian creates and BB Album he likes and Mike, Bruce, Al, David and perhaps Blondie come in and record on it and Mike and Bruce go out on the road perhaps taking the other three with them at times? 
That would please everyone with any sense.

[SMiLE Brian]

In perfect world, thats how it should work. But Mike and Brian's main problem has always been dividing the studio and touring world of the BBs.