How much of American Spring was Brian responsible for?

[Custom Machine]

Excellent overview of the original Spring LP, feelsflow (will abbreviate to FF henceforth!). I'm in 100% agreement with your track evaluation and it's interesting to put that against Andrew's well-informed speculations about session chronology, etc.

Only one quibble here, re "Superstar": while I have mucho admiration for Bonnie Bramlett's version, someone (in this case me...) should stick up for Karen Carpenter's rendition, which transcends her brother's string-laden proclivities and (arguably) deserves to be considered the best vocal interpretation of the song. YMMV on that point, but we clearly agree that the Rovell sisters weren't really the right singers for this tune, no matter how much they (obviously) liked it.

Well, in this case my mileage does vary, as I consider the Spring version of Superstar to be by far the best one out there.  This is most likely due in large part to the fact that Marilyn Rovell Wilson is one of my two favorite female singers, the other being Veronica Ronnie Bennett Spector.

[Jim V.]

Further caveat - just because someone gets a half or one-third credit on a track, doesn't mean they actually did contribute 50% or 33.33% of the arrangement, production or whatever.

Also known as The Mike Love Principle.

More like The Spector Syndrome.

Nah, more like The Presley Problem. He (due to the Colonel's maneuverings) got credit on a bunch of stuff he had nothing to do with writing. This being a few years before Spector or Mike Love getting their names on stuff that they had little to do with.

[feelsflow]

SWD wasn't working for the BB in 1967.

Actually he was.

Took me awhile to get back here, but I wanted to add where I "got the impression" SWD was "working" with the boys back in 1967.

But first - Don, thanks for the support.  Karen had a beautiful voice.  My favorite Carpenters track was "Top of the World" - One of the ones Richard had a hand in writing.  They also, always did a great job with Nichols/Williams numbers.

Custom Machine - Rob, I have enjoyed many of the threads you have taken part in, none more than your relentless pursuit to get to the bottom of Brian's visit to KHJ in July 1967, (in the Heroes and Villains released 45 Years Ago Today thread back in 2012).  Just the other day, bgas quoted me one on SOS.  You are good for this board.

Andrew,  I have spent years reading the old threads and archives from the old board.  There is a lot to learn there, history is a wonderful thing.  I am going to let Stephen speak for himself.  I'll tap it in, so you don't have to go searching through threads.

Sunday March 17, 2002 -9:19am  Reply to Mr_Marcus's comments:

Perhaps I can answer some questions as I was there assisting Jim on various songs and engineered the following songs (but did not receive album credit) when Jim got sick.  He was in and out a lot due to excessive coughing and breathing problems.  A great guy!

Mama Says     Vegetables     Heroes and Villains     She's Goin' Bald

Fall Breaks and Back to Winter     Friends     Little Bird     Wind Chimes

Whistle In     Anna Lee, The Healer     Be Here in the Mornin'     Wake the World

We all have moments where our memories fault on us, old age does that.  I would have fixed my post if you would have given me a mo - play nice.

peace,  Will

[punkinhead]

Also, come on, let's have a discussion about how awkward "Tennessee Waltz" must've been to record?

Not to me. Very beautiful cover! There's sth. about the way Marilyn sings it that I find homey & charming. The arrangements are classy, typical Brian. Wish it was longer than 1:56 min.

Another song I like is "Shyin' Away". Really great performance here, not the 1st time when I hear jazz notes in Marilyn's voice. It's such a great song overall! Full of elegance, grace & light positivity.

Other than that, the BBs' versions of Good Time, Had to Phone Ya, Lady etc. are much superior to the ones sung by American Spring. In my humble opinion.

I agree about the BB versions but I LOVE the cover of Had to Phone Ya, Spring's version was done after 15BO, right? The backing track is so different.

[Wrightfan]

I believe that version is from 1972 actually

[Bicyclerider]

Further caveat - just because someone gets a half or one-third credit on a track, doesn't mean they actually did contribute 50% or 33.33% of the arrangement, production or whatever.

Also known as The Mike Love Principle.

More like The Spector Syndrome.

I think the powers that be, including Marilyn and Diane, wanted Brian to appear to be more involved with the album than he was, which would garner the album more attention and press.  In fact Rolling Stone did give it a very favorable review and suggested that if the Beach Boys wanted to add more members (they had just added Ricky and Blondie) they should have considered Marilyn and Diane!

[Rotat]

Rolling Stone did give it a very favorable review and suggested that if the Beach Boys wanted to add more members (they had just added Ricky and Blondie) they should have considered Marilyn and Diane!

I actually kinda agree with that! I wouldn't change history or anything at all, but their voices were awesome, I think they might have benefited from more of their voices. Then again that mid 70s period was quite different than what is on the American Spring LP so perhaps their voices wouldn't have gelled much with the songs anyways. Certainly love their voices and what they sang on some of that Brian Wilson written material!

[Andrew G. Doe]

I believe that version is from 1972 actually

Correct - from the 1972/1973 Fort Dodge sessions.

[Gohi]

Further caveat - just because someone gets a half or one-third credit on a track, doesn't mean they actually did contribute 50% or 33.33% of the arrangement, production or whatever.

Also known as The Mike Love Principle.

More like The Spector Syndrome.

I think the powers that be, including Marilyn and Diane, wanted Brian to appear to be more involved with the album than he was, which would garner the album more attention and press.  In fact Rolling Stone did give it a very favorable review and suggested that if the Beach Boys wanted to add more members (they had just added Ricky and Blondie) they should have considered Marilyn and Diane!

Oh my God. Can you imagine what a trainwreck that would have been with all the behind the scenes drama and Brian's obsession with Diane?