Track Talk #4: Land Ahoy (& Cherry Cherry Coupe)

[Disney Boy (1985)]

I love both Land Ahoy and Cherry Cherry Coupe and up until this moment had never made the connection between the two. Coupe seems a little pacier. Both great though.

[runnersdialzero]

Anyone else think "Land Ahoy" is better than most of the stuff on the Surfin' Safari album?

[LetHimRun]

The solenoid system in this instance was for "hot rodders" who shaved their door handles. Meaning, the cars were altered by taking the door handles off for looks. There had to be a way to open the doors and they put solenoid systems in.

Makes sense, I'm not saying it's not what happened because it was, but again I think the real hot rodders who actually competed were trying to shave off anything extra in general, and adding electronic locks and the system to power and run them doesn't seem to fit the "less is more" credo. The reasons why some of the true rods looked so bare-bones is because they did everything to reduce weight and increase power, which would mean stripping anything unessential to the engine and the car's power off of the car.

Unless we're getting into "customs" from the California builders/designers the Beach Boys would have been aware of at that time like George Barris, Dean Jeffries, etc. If it's a car for show, and to cruise and get chicks, then yeah, having solenoids and relays and Air Ride suspensions and all of that to do cool stuff like pop open your doors would be nice to have!

No, you are right. With everything, there are varying degrees. There are those who shaved door handles only for looks and for the scene and put in the solenoid systems to have easy operating doors. The pure racers did what you said, they stripped all necessary equipment to get every edge possible. But not everyone raced to that extent and a lot of the cars were for cruising, thus the solenoid systems that were put in.

As for the spelling of "cellunoid" versus "solenoid", I have no clue where the former came from. Is that how Roger thought it was spelled? It may have been a local thing as you said. Mike also pronounces it as "cell-u-noid" because "solenoid" is not pronounced with the "cellu" sound, it's "sol-e-noid" as one would read it.

[I. Spaceman]

Anyone else think "Land Ahoy" is better than most of the stuff on the Surfin' Safari album?

I think it is definitely better than Summertime Blues, about equal with Ten Little Indians and Heads You Win Tails I Lose, not as good as the rest.

[Disney Boy (1985)]

Anyone else think "Land Ahoy" is better than most of the stuff on the Surfin' Safari album?

Yep. To think they had Land Ahoy and Lonely Sea and they left them both off the album??!!

[Disney Boy (1985)]

Leaving great songs off albums to replace them with average ones would of course remain a Beach Boys habit for the rest of their career...

[guitarfool2002]

The solenoid system in this instance was for "hot rodders" who shaved their door handles. Meaning, the cars were altered by taking the door handles off for looks. There had to be a way to open the doors and they put solenoid systems in.

Makes sense, I'm not saying it's not what happened because it was, but again I think the real hot rodders who actually competed were trying to shave off anything extra in general, and adding electronic locks and the system to power and run them doesn't seem to fit the "less is more" credo. The reasons why some of the true rods looked so bare-bones is because they did everything to reduce weight and increase power, which would mean stripping anything unessential to the engine and the car's power off of the car.

Unless we're getting into "customs" from the California builders/designers the Beach Boys would have been aware of at that time like George Barris, Dean Jeffries, etc. If it's a car for show, and to cruise and get chicks, then yeah, having solenoids and relays and Air Ride suspensions and all of that to do cool stuff like pop open your doors would be nice to have!

No, you are right. With everything, there are varying degrees. There are those who shaved door handles only for looks and for the scene and put in the solenoid systems to have easy operating doors. The pure racers did what you said, they stripped all necessary equipment to get every edge possible. But not everyone raced to that extent and a lot of the cars were for cruising, thus the solenoid systems that were put in.

As for the spelling of "cellunoid" versus "solenoid", I have no clue where the former came from. Is that how Roger thought it was spelled? It may have been a local thing as you said.

I brought up the dialect thing because I know I've heard some of the old-school mechanics call it that, and I'm really wracking my brain trying to remember but I think my dad was one of them! Much like yours, my dad got out of the service after the war in '46 and started working on cars, and happened to be working at a Chevy dealership in the 50's and 60's, when all the classics came out! So his view of the "legendary" 409 engine isn't as positive as others because to him, the 409 was an engine that he'd see come in the garage all the time when the kids who thought they were racers would ruin them by revving them up and causing the valves to pop...

I'm partial to the 50-53 Chevys myself, I think they are about as classy and as cool as any cars, and the original colors were amazing. I like 'em all, but something about that era was different.

[I. Spaceman]

So his view of the "legendary" 409 engine isn't as positive as others because to him, the 409 was an engine that he'd see come in the garage all the time when the kids who thought they were racers would ruin them by revving them up and causing the valves to pop...  

Which, of course, is also what Roger Christian said on-air at KFWB, inspiring the listening Murry Wilson to call in and invite Roger to meet up with Brian.

[guitarfool2002]

He said that on KFWB too? That's cool, if I read that before I don't remember! I just remember my dad saying the same thing about the 409 anytime it came up, how it was a pain in the ass because of the valves and they'd be in his garage all the time. I think it may be a case of the engine being more of a legend because of the BB's singing about it than it actually was widely considered a good engine.

But then again, opinions among car guys is like debating Chevy vs. Ford, there's no winner...

[punkinhead]

Dislike it greatly. Can't deal with the drum rhythm, the lead vocal, the lyrics, anything about it.

the drumming drives me nuts on Land Ahoy

[LetHimRun]

The solenoid system in this instance was for "hot rodders" who shaved their door handles. Meaning, the cars were altered by taking the door handles off for looks. There had to be a way to open the doors and they put solenoid systems in.

Makes sense, I'm not saying it's not what happened because it was, but again I think the real hot rodders who actually competed were trying to shave off anything extra in general, and adding electronic locks and the system to power and run them doesn't seem to fit the "less is more" credo. The reasons why some of the true rods looked so bare-bones is because they did everything to reduce weight and increase power, which would mean stripping anything unessential to the engine and the car's power off of the car.

Unless we're getting into "customs" from the California builders/designers the Beach Boys would have been aware of at that time like George Barris, Dean Jeffries, etc. If it's a car for show, and to cruise and get chicks, then yeah, having solenoids and relays and Air Ride suspensions and all of that to do cool stuff like pop open your doors would be nice to have!

No, you are right. With everything, there are varying degrees. There are those who shaved door handles only for looks and for the scene and put in the solenoid systems to have easy operating doors. The pure racers did what you said, they stripped all necessary equipment to get every edge possible. But not everyone raced to that extent and a lot of the cars were for cruising, thus the solenoid systems that were put in.

As for the spelling of "cellunoid" versus "solenoid", I have no clue where the former came from. Is that how Roger thought it was spelled? It may have been a local thing as you said.

I brought up the dialect thing because I know I've heard some of the old-school mechanics call it that, and I'm really wracking my brain trying to remember but I think my dad was one of them! Much like yours, my dad got out of the service after the war in '46 and started working on cars, and happened to be working at a Chevy dealership in the 50's and 60's, when all the classics came out! So his view of the "legendary" 409 engine isn't as positive as others because to him, the 409 was an engine that he'd see come in the garage all the time when the kids who thought they were racers would ruin them by revving them up and causing the valves to pop...

I'm partial to the 50-53 Chevys myself, I think they are about as classy and as cool as any cars, and the original colors were amazing. I like 'em all, but something about that era was different.

You are probably right about the old school mechanics. I'm a bit behind you (I'm 29) as my dad was born in '44. Mine was about 13 when he started in his dad's shop, so that would have been about 1956-1957.

The 409 was a high performance engine, and like most engines like that, it helped if you didn't have dumb kids revving them so high that they broke. As I said earlier, my dad and I have a '51 Chevy (two door sedan). It isn't a stock color, I did want a stock two tone, but we settled on blue body/white top.

[smilethebeachboysloveyou]

"Cherry, Cherry Coupe" is an excellent example of Roger Christian's lyric writing abilities; the fact that he is able to fit a bulky technical term like "solenoid system" into meter and rhyme without making it sound contrived is really quite impressive.  As far as the comparison between "Cherry, Cherry Coupe" and the earlier "Land Ahoy" goes, it seems to me that "Cherry, Cherry Coupe" has to win because of the notable improvement in Brian Wilson's production abilities.

I think the slower tempo to the later song also lends credence to the theory that the titular car is meant for showing rather than drag-racing.  I know absolutely nothing about cars (being a city-dweller, I don't even own one) but it seems like the drag-racing car songs ("Shut Down," "Little Deuce Coupe," "Custom Machine") tend to be faster-paced than the cruising car songs ("Our Car Club" and "Cherry, Cherry Coupe").  It's not an absolute law, as "No Go Showboat" is a bit faster (perhaps ironically?) but it seems like an effective matching of form and content in the songs where it works.

[lance]

What I love about the backing track of Cherry Cherry coupe is that it kind of sounds like a really tight, tuned up engine idling. You can hear the little pops of steam and rumbling and hissing and so on.

[guitarfool2002]

The interesting point for me is still the question: Is it a car for show or a car for racing? If it is for show, you'll have perhaps the handle-less door option which Mike sang about, you'll have a nice engine that purrs but then again, you'll also have that engine cleaned and polished so when you raise the hood, it shines and people seeing it go "aaahhhhh!". If it is for race, none of that matters. You'll get oil, dirt, and all kinds of gunk all over the polished parts anyway, and speed is the goal over looks so if you're going to race, it doesn't matter.

I'm leaning toward the lyrics being a "show" over "race" car.

[buddhahat]

The solenoid system in this instance was for "hot rodders" who shaved their door handles. Meaning, the cars were altered by taking the door handles off for looks. There had to be a way to open the doors and they put solenoid systems in.

Loving all the hot rod info in this thread, thanks!

So this video shows the solenoid system in operation (about 2.08), presumably as it was in the 50s/60s (although they didn't use remotes then, right?):

http://youtu.be/EsOsqE6Ql98

The guy also seems to pronounce it "cellunoid".

[I. Spaceman]

The interesting point for me is still the question: Is it a car for show or a car for racing? If it is for show, you'll have perhaps the handle-less door option which Mike sang about, you'll have a nice engine that purrs but then again, you'll also have that engine cleaned and polished so when you raise the hood, it shines and people seeing it go "aaahhhhh!". If it is for race, none of that matters. You'll get oil, dirt, and all kinds of gunk all over the polished parts anyway, and speed is the goal over looks so if you're going to race, it doesn't matter.

I'm leaning toward the lyrics being a "show" over "race" car.

Just read the lyrics. He makes references mainly to the look of the car, but also boasts a bit about the speed.

[guitarfool2002]

The interesting point for me is still the question: Is it a car for show or a car for racing? If it is for show, you'll have perhaps the handle-less door option which Mike sang about, you'll have a nice engine that purrs but then again, you'll also have that engine cleaned and polished so when you raise the hood, it shines and people seeing it go "aaahhhhh!". If it is for race, none of that matters. You'll get oil, dirt, and all kinds of gunk all over the polished parts anyway, and speed is the goal over looks so if you're going to race, it doesn't matter.

I'm leaning toward the lyrics being a "show" over "race" car.

Just read the lyrics. He makes references mainly to the look of the car, but also boasts a bit about the speed.

If it's a dream car, an ideal of a dream car, it could be both! In the real world, drag racers wouldn't have electronic doors on their car.

So thinking of it as the mythology that the BB's were so good at creating in their music and lyrics, it's both a show car and a race car.

But these same guys also sang about a "No Go Showboat" which could be describing that driver who has the best looking and cleanest show car, with all the options and trimmings (including shaving the door handles), but who can't race.

[joe_blow]

I'm a big fan of Cherry Cherry Coupe. Thoughh I had heard it before, it wasn't until it appeared on Little Steven's Underground Garage that I took an extra liking towards it. On one of the episides, (I think from 2005?, which should still be listenable on his website) Brian himself guesthosts and sings a few bars of the song.

On another note, has Mike Love publicly acknowledged Roger Christian's abilities before?

[guitarfool2002]

The guy also seems to pronounce it "cellunoid".

Yep! See my above post about dialect and old-school pronunciations. It's the way some of the old-school mechanics like my dad said it, and I think it just got passed down.

[buddhahat]

The guy also seems to pronounce it "cellunoid".

Yep! See my above post about dialect and old-school pronunciations. It's the way some of the old-school mechanics like my dad said it, and I think it just got passed down.

Thanks for the info!

[guitarfool2002]

No-go showboat, no-go showboat (No-go showboat)
Well, I got a wild custom That wins every show But it's a no-go showboat (No-go showboat)
Yeah but everybody knows That she just don't go She's my no-go showboat (No-go showboat)
White wall slicks with racing mags She's just for looks, man, not for drags 'Cause it's a no-go showboat (No-go showboat)
No go No go
Well, the guys all dig it They've got no complaints About my no-go showboat (No-go showboat)
And the chicks really flip for That metal flake paint On my no-go showboat (No-go showboat)
It really rates fine in the custom clan With hand-formed panels, tuck-and-roll rear pan 'Cause it's a no-go showboat (No-go showboat)
No go No go
Well, the engine compartment's filled With all chrome goodies In my no-go showboat (No-go showboat)
Yeah but everybody takes me Even old Ford woodies In my no-go showboat (No-go showboat)
When it comes to speed, man, I'm just outa luck I'm even shut down by the ice cream truck 'Cause it's a no-go showboat (No-go showboat)
No go No go
No-go showboat (No-go showboat) No-go showboat (No-go showboat)
She's just my (No-go showboat)


"She's just for looks, man, not for drags..."

Read these lyrics - it's exactly what I was describing earlier. Ol' Rog knew what he was talking about with cars, and the differences between racers and "showboats"...notice the bold lyric plus the line about the "engine compartment filled with all chrome goodies", that's exactly the car you'd raise the hood and make people go "aaahhhh!!!" when they saw it shine, but that wasn't what the real dragsters had under the hood.

Cruising versus racing - sometimes the cruisers would race but generally it's a different type of car for those two purposes.

Again, Roger Christian deserves a lot of credit for his contributions because he really was tapped into the car scene, and not just in SoCal in 1962. You'd have to be involved in it to get the stories and the words right, and I don't think anyone accused them of being artificial or phony.

[Paulos]

Mikes bass vocal on the 'My cherry coupe beats 'em up coming off the line and she really gets lost when she starts to whine' part of the chorus is just plain brilliant, great song from a highly underrated album.

Also, in this instance what does 'cherry' mean? I'm assuming it's used in the same context as in Surf City (You know it's not very cherry, it's an oldie but a goody)?

[ontor pertawst]

Mint condition.

[Paulos]

Mint condition.

Thanks, thought it must be something like that.

[SBonilla]

Anyone else think "Land Ahoy" is better than most of the stuff on the Surfin' Safari album?

Not me. Though, it's on a par with some of them.