Mike Love (Celebrate The New News / Old News?)

[drbeachboy]

I usually don't get involved in these disparaging types of things because I try to see all sides of the situation, but I really want to say that I find the "Melinda"  and "Wifeandmanagers" labels to be insulting to Melinda, Brian, Jeff, the band, and everyone who are trying to support Brian and help him stay happy and productive. From all accounts, Melinda acts on Brain's behalf with his good in mind. She is a strong woman, yes. You would have to be, to be married to someone with Brian's issues. She is someone who has to make the tough decisions (possibly because Brian won't) and some of her decisions might make it harder for Mike to pretend it's still 1962 and write surfing songs with his cousin (which, in my mind, is just a convenient excuse).   Apparently Brian wants or needs her to run interference for him, so she does. To equate someone who genuinely cares for Brian and is taking a strong position for his good to the manipulative, grasping, self-serving and Brian damaging piece of crap that Landy was, is just a major injustice, to me.

Whatever support system Brian needs, he currently has. The evidence that it's working is his solo career, tours, a long and difficult Beach Boys reunion tour that he actually enjoyed doing, a number 3 charting album, and his current burst of creativity in the studio. If supporting him at that level means that Mike can't  churn out a hook in 5 minutes in the studio parking lot, then so be it.

Well it's unfortunate to say the least which is where I'll begin.  It's unfortunate that Brian Wilson in the sixties was unable to get the help he needed, at the time he needed it which may have prevented some of the complications that have plagued his life in comparison with others.  It's unfortunate that Melinda Wilson gets disparaged for merely acting in her husband's best interests and for all we know with his blessing.  I know that Brian Wilson has gone on record that without Melinda, he probably wouldn't have ever toured again so obviously Beach Boys and Brian Wilson fans owe Melinda Wilson a debt of gratitude on that front and probably all other fronts which encompass the professional side of Brian Wilson's life.

It's unfortunate that Mike Love can't or is unable to find a comfort zone with his cousin after all of these years where they can enjoy both working with each other professionally and enjoying the company of one another as family members.  It's obvious from almost every quote that I have ever read from Mike Love regarding Brian Wilson that he has nothing but affection for his cousin and although we can tear strips off Mike Love for a million different things, one thing I've always respected him for is his honesty.  Therefore I have no doubt that he ran into complications of some degree last year in working with Brian Wilson and that is the reason why The Beach Boys aren't together anymore.  That too is obviously unfortunate for the band and their fans.

The bright side?  Well as Mike Love himself said, Brian Wilson has his band and M&B are out doing their thing as well.  Both groups are drawing audiences, making money and carrying on the legacy of the band in their own separate way.  They also have that handsome box set that is going to be released in a few weeks time which will no doubt bring about all different types of emotions from the fanbase.  The word: bittersweet perhaps is the best way to describe the temperature of the room right now.

Well said! I think you are right on the mark, here.

[clack]

I respect Mike's wish to write with Brian again. 1962-65 produced so many Wilson/Love classics, Brian and Mike are now in their 70s, time is fleeting -- I imagine Mike must feel the pull of nostalgia, the temptation of one last batch of co-written songs to add to the canon and to close the circle.

Despite Mike's rep as the crass extrovert and Brian's as the sensitive introvert, I get the impression that Mike has always been the more nostalgic one, looking back with longing to the early glory years (Do it Again). So, I understand why Mike would want to write with Brian -- really co-write, not be assigned (for reasons more political than creative) to just add some lines to an already mostly written song.

But why would Brian want to write with Mike? Why would Brian think that Mike still had anything creative to bring to the table? What evidence has Mike given him, or anyone?

[Cam Mott]

I respect Mike's wish to write with Brian again. 1962-65 produced so many Wilson/Love classics, Brian and Mike are now in their 70s, time is fleeting -- I imagine Mike must feel the pull of nostalgia, the temptation of one last batch of co-written songs to add to the canon and to close the circle.

Despite Mike's rep as the crass extrovert and Brian's as the sensitive introvert, I get the impression that Mike has always been the more nostalgic one, looking back with longing to the early glory years (Do it Again). So, I understand why Mike would want to write with Brian -- really co-write, not be assigned (for reasons more political than creative) to just add some lines to an already mostly written song.

But why would Brian want to write with Mike? Why would Brian think that Mike still had anything creative to bring to the table? What evidence has Mike given him, or anyone?

I believe Brian praises Mike's lyrics and abilities, so he apparently brings something to the table as much or more as any of Brian's one/few off co-authors of the past and present have for Brian. Brian is also the one who has been telling Mike he wants them to work together. It looks to me like Mike has good reason to wonder/blame somebody for preventing what Brian tells him he wants.

[Cyncie]

I usually don't get involved in these disparaging types of things because I try to see all sides of the situation, but I really want to say that I find the "Melinda"  and "Wifeandmanagers" labels to be insulting to Melinda, Brian, Jeff, the band, and everyone who are trying to support Brian and help him stay happy and productive. From all accounts, Melinda acts on Brain's behalf with his good in mind. She is a strong woman, yes. You would have to be, to be married to someone with Brian's issues. She is someone who has to make the tough decisions (possibly because Brian won't) and some of her decisions might make it harder for Mike to pretend it's still 1962 and write surfing songs with his cousin (which, in my mind, is just a convenient excuse).   Apparently Brian wants or needs her to run interference for him, so she does. To equate someone who genuinely cares for Brian and is taking a strong position for his good to the manipulative, grasping, self-serving and Brian damaging piece of crap that Landy was, is just a major injustice, to me.

Whatever support system Brian needs, he currently has. The evidence that it's working is his solo career, tours, a long and difficult Beach Boys reunion tour that he actually enjoyed doing, a number 3 charting album, and his current burst of creativity in the studio. If supporting him at that level means that Mike can't  churn out a hook in 5 minutes in the studio parking lot, then so be it.

Well it's unfortunate to say the least which is where I'll begin.  It's unfortunate that Brian Wilson in the sixties was unable to get the help he needed, at the time he needed it which may have prevented some of the complications that have plagued his life in comparison with others.  It's unfortunate that Melinda Wilson gets disparaged for merely acting in her husband's best interests and for all we know with his blessing.  I know that Brian Wilson has gone on record that without Melinda, he probably wouldn't have ever toured again so obviously Beach Boys and Brian Wilson fans owe Melinda Wilson a debt of gratitude on that front and probably all other fronts which encompass the professional side of Brian Wilson's life.

It's unfortunate that Mike Love can't or is unable to find a comfort zone with his cousin after all of these years where they can enjoy both working with each other professionally and enjoying the company of one another as family members.  It's obvious from almost every quote that I have ever read from Mike Love regarding Brian Wilson that he has nothing but affection for his cousin and although we can tear strips off Mike Love for a million different things, one thing I've always respected him for is his honesty.  Therefore I have no doubt that he ran into complications of some degree last year in working with Brian Wilson and that is the reason why The Beach Boys aren't together anymore.  That too is obviously unfortunate for the band and their fans.

The bright side?  Well as Mike Love himself said, Brian Wilson has his band and M&B are out doing their thing as well.  Both groups are drawing audiences, making money and carrying on the legacy of the band in their own separate way.  They also have that handsome box set that is going to be released in a few weeks time which will no doubt bring about all different types of emotions from the fanbase.  The word: bittersweet perhaps is the best way to describe the temperature of the room right now.

I agree with much of what you say, here. I'm not trying to imply that Mike doesn't care for Brian and isn't genuine in his wishes. My main purpose was to counter some of the unwarranted negativism that Melinda seems to be subject to. I do feel that, when asked about certain types of situations, Mike is very good at finding a glib answer, especially when the subject is Cousin Brian.  Over the years, he has become very adept at skirting around the 500 pound gorilla of Brian's mental illness, time and again. When he is asked what happened to The Beach Boys after SMiLE, his standard reply is, "the Wilson's were on drugs. I wasn't."  And, while that is certainly the truth, it's a bit too convenient and simplistic to blame everything on drugs and ignore years of abuse, mental illness, band and recording company pressures and dysfunctional family relationships. When asked about the current situation, his quick response is that he loves Brian (certainly true), and would work with him again (also probably true), if "the others" would get out of the way (ignoring the gorilla, since "the others" are part of Brian's support system).  Maybe he finds it all just a bit too difficult.

As I said in another discussion, my perception is that there is a new reality for The Beach Boys. One reality is that  the music biz is more complicated than it was in 1963 and everyone has a lawyer and representation. Including Mike, I'm sure. 2013 is not 1962, no matter how much any of them would like it to be. Maybe Mike truly feels that he and Brian could turn out some new pop masterpieces, if he didn't have to deal with all the middle men. But, I'm sure Mike has set up his own legal gauntlet that Brian's people get to run. It is certainly too bad that two cousins can't just sit down and write, but business is business.

At any rate, the Brian Wilson currently recording in the studio now is not the same young cousin and band buddy Mike grew up with. Too much time and trauma have seen to that.  Mike has changed, too, and his reality is that he has to deal with Brian in a different way than he once did. At the moment, he doesn't appear to be ready to do that.

Brian also has to deal with a new reality. Mike has successfully led the band for years without his input or assistance in any way. He has kept The Beach Boys name alive and available to the public, and has worked hard touring the songs they produced together. Mike, and not Brian, has been the "leader" of the Beach Boys for a long time now. His effort, work ethic  and experience in touring deserves some consideration and respect from Brian's people. Brian's legacy is secure. He will always be the genius behind The Beach Boys.  There's nothing wrong with letting Mike hold on to the place he's carved out for himself as the leader of the touring band.

I'm actually hoping Mike will invite Brian over for Thanksgiving dinner, and over some nice tofurky, they'll realize that they need each other. After all, without Brian's music, Mike would be performing a very short program. And, without Mike's touring efforts, Brian wouldn't have had much to come back to last year.

[JohnMill]

I usually don't get involved in these disparaging types of things because I try to see all sides of the situation, but I really want to say that I find the "Melinda"  and "Wifeandmanagers" labels to be insulting to Melinda, Brian, Jeff, the band, and everyone who are trying to support Brian and help him stay happy and productive. From all accounts, Melinda acts on Brain's behalf with his good in mind. She is a strong woman, yes. You would have to be, to be married to someone with Brian's issues. She is someone who has to make the tough decisions (possibly because Brian won't) and some of her decisions might make it harder for Mike to pretend it's still 1962 and write surfing songs with his cousin (which, in my mind, is just a convenient excuse).   Apparently Brian wants or needs her to run interference for him, so she does. To equate someone who genuinely cares for Brian and is taking a strong position for his good to the manipulative, grasping, self-serving and Brian damaging piece of crap that Landy was, is just a major injustice, to me.

Whatever support system Brian needs, he currently has. The evidence that it's working is his solo career, tours, a long and difficult Beach Boys reunion tour that he actually enjoyed doing, a number 3 charting album, and his current burst of creativity in the studio. If supporting him at that level means that Mike can't  churn out a hook in 5 minutes in the studio parking lot, then so be it.

Well it's unfortunate to say the least which is where I'll begin.  It's unfortunate that Brian Wilson in the sixties was unable to get the help he needed, at the time he needed it which may have prevented some of the complications that have plagued his life in comparison with others.  It's unfortunate that Melinda Wilson gets disparaged for merely acting in her husband's best interests and for all we know with his blessing.  I know that Brian Wilson has gone on record that without Melinda, he probably wouldn't have ever toured again so obviously Beach Boys and Brian Wilson fans owe Melinda Wilson a debt of gratitude on that front and probably all other fronts which encompass the professional side of Brian Wilson's life.

It's unfortunate that Mike Love can't or is unable to find a comfort zone with his cousin after all of these years where they can enjoy both working with each other professionally and enjoying the company of one another as family members.  It's obvious from almost every quote that I have ever read from Mike Love regarding Brian Wilson that he has nothing but affection for his cousin and although we can tear strips off Mike Love for a million different things, one thing I've always respected him for is his honesty.  Therefore I have no doubt that he ran into complications of some degree last year in working with Brian Wilson and that is the reason why The Beach Boys aren't together anymore.  That too is obviously unfortunate for the band and their fans.

The bright side?  Well as Mike Love himself said, Brian Wilson has his band and M&B are out doing their thing as well.  Both groups are drawing audiences, making money and carrying on the legacy of the band in their own separate way.  They also have that handsome box set that is going to be released in a few weeks time which will no doubt bring about all different types of emotions from the fanbase.  The word: bittersweet perhaps is the best way to describe the temperature of the room right now.

I agree with much of what you say, here. I'm not trying to imply that Mike doesn't care for Brian and isn't genuine in his wishes. My main purpose was to counter some of the unwarranted negativism that Melinda seems to be subject to. I do feel that, when asked about certain types of situations, Mike is very good at finding a glib answer, especially when the subject is Cousin Brian.  Over the years, he has become very adept at skirting around the 500 pound gorilla of Brian's mental illness, time and again. When he is asked what happened to The Beach Boys after SMiLE, his standard reply is, "the Wilson's were on drugs. I wasn't."  And, while that is certainly the truth, it's a bit too convenient and simplistic to blame everything on drugs and ignore years of abuse, mental illness, band and recording company pressures and dysfunctional family relationships. When asked about the current situation, his quick response is that he loves Brian (certainly true), and would work with him again (also probably true), if "the others" would get out of the way (ignoring the gorilla, since "the others" are part of Brian's support system).  Maybe he finds it all just a bit too difficult.

As I said in another discussion, my perception is that there is a new reality for The Beach Boys. One reality is that  the music biz is more complicated than it was in 1963 and everyone has a lawyer and representation. Including Mike, I'm sure. 2013 is not 1962, no matter how much any of them would like it to be. Maybe Mike truly feels that he and Brian could turn out some new pop masterpieces, if he didn't have to deal with all the middle men. But, I'm sure Mike has set up his own legal gauntlet that Brian's people get to run. It is certainly too bad that two cousins can't just sit down and write, but business is business.

At any rate, the Brian Wilson currently recording in the studio now is not the same young cousin and band buddy Mike grew up with. Too much time and trauma have seen to that.  Mike has changed, too, and his reality is that he has to deal with Brian in a different way than he once did. At the moment, he doesn't appear to be ready to do that.

Brian also has to deal with a new reality. Mike has successfully led the band for years without his input or assistance in any way. He has kept The Beach Boys name alive and available to the public, and has worked hard touring the songs they produced together. Mike, and not Brian, has been the "leader" of the Beach Boys for a long time now. His effort, work ethic  and experience in touring deserves some consideration and respect from Brian's people. Brian's legacy is secure. He will always be the genius behind The Beach Boys.  There's nothing wrong with letting Mike hold on to the place he's carved out for himself as the leader of the touring band.

I'm actually hoping Mike will invite Brian over for Thanksgiving dinner, and over some nice tofurky, they'll realize that they need each other. After all, without Brian's music, Mike would be performing a very short program. And, without Mike's touring efforts, Brian wouldn't have had much to come back to last year.

I think Mike Love is wholly and truly aware of Brian Wilson's battles with mental illness but that being said I'm sure he's aware there isn't really anything he can do about it.  Mike Love made his attempt back during the era of "SMiLE" to get some of the dopers and hangers-on away from his cousin but Brian Wilson just couldn't be had back then and continued to exacerbate his fragile mental state with the intake of psychedelic drugs.  I don't think you can separate one from the other.  I certainly don't anyway and therefore cannot really judge Mike Love if he believes much of Brian's fragile mental state was brought on by his abuse of drugs.  I'm not saying that is 100% accurate objectively speaking but it's not so far out of the realm of possibilities where it would be ludicrous to suggest it.  

I wrote a few weeks back that one thing that Mike Love has to realize and maybe he does although his desire to write songs one on one with Brian Wilson would suggest otherwise.  The one realization Mike Love needs to come to is that he is no longer part of Brian Wilson's inner circle and probably hasn't been since oh around 1964 or so.  To me, at least it's always been patently clear that as Brian Wilson began to evolve as a songwriter he sort of outgrew the nuclear unit that was The Beach Boys.  He started spending more time with people like Tony Asher, Van Dyke Parks, The "Vosse Posse" and all the rest.  I think as was suggested in "Look Listen Vibrate SMiLE" that by 1966 certainly in Brian's world there was a "new Beach Boys" and this unit didn't include Mike Love.  Then you had the Landy years which really isolated Brian Wilson from society and the recovery from that experience which I'm sure to this day is still a day to day process.  So it does make sense now that Brian Wilson surrounds himself with people who are keenly aware of his situation and are agreeable to it.  As I read in another Brian Wilson piece not too long ago, it is no secret that Wilson surrounds himself with people who encourage and support him rather than challenge him.  So while I don't doubt that Mike Love has nothing but good intentions in wanting to renew his songwriting partnership with his cousin, the fact of the matter is Mike Love was elbowed out of Brian's inner circle decades ago.  Bandmates yes.  Family again yes.  But best friends?  Unfortunately probably not even close and that is what I perceive to be the main hurdle that Mike Love keeps hitting into every time he wants to work with his cousin.  Brian Wilson works with people who are close with him both on a personal and professional level and unfortunately Mike Love doesn't cast well in that role.

Now Mike Love from the perspective of the day to day grunt work that goes into what the M&B show is able to pull off every summer is by no doubt the leader of that operation.  But as I also mentioned a few weeks back if The Beach Boys were a law firm, Brian Wilson would be the senior partner with his name above everyone else on the company stationary.  He might not take as many cases as the rest of the firm but he gives the firm their legitimacy and I've never been all together sure and perhaps even less so after the C50 if Mike Love is comfortable about that.  It's become patently clear that Mike Love had to acquiesce to a great many demands to get the C50 up and running last year.  To secure Brian Wilson's involvement in the project, to record TWGMTR, to placate the needs of Brian Wilson during the tour itself...it's quite obvious that Mike Love had a lot more grunt work last year than what he has been dealing with as far as the M&B shows go.  Maybe he just felt the need to be in control of his own destiny again?  Maybe the end didn't suit the means in regards to the fact that whatever needs or demands he would've had to acquiesce to in order to keep The Beach Boys in tact.  Maybe it was the fact that unlike Al Jardine and David Marks, he had a legitimate money making venture he could return to in lieu of continuing the C50?  For whatever reason, Mike Love quit "The Beach Boys" last October.

I too hope that one day that Brian Wilson and Mike Love can get together and get their relationship back on track if not professionally than personally.  Compromise is truly a wonderful thing when it all works out and I guess the million dollar question in regards to this issue is which side was unwilling to compromise enough to keep the C50 alive?  Brian's people have taken their fair share of bashing but you could also turn the whole thing around on Mike Love too if you want as he obviously could've kept the C50 going if that was his intention.  Like I said whenever any of The Beach Boys speak about the band there is always a bittersweet element to their words.  Perhaps in the end it's somewhat appropriate that for guys whose songs harken back to more innocent bygone times and who love to wax nostalgic/poetic about their past, seem themselves to have no semblance of a present and perhaps a future collectively speaking.