MOJO Special Spolier

[The Shift]

Listening to that lead single-tracked lead vocal, it's beautifully warm and intimate compared to the double tracked version.

And can someone remind me of some history here - it's Brian handling the words "home on the range" in each verse, right, same as he did the high notes for the words "I love the sound of her" on Good Vibes?

Add: in fact, listening to the 30+ Cabinessence files on my 'puter, they're all so completely and utter different that I'm gonna have to get the two-fer out and see how the new file compares to that!

[Cliff1000uk]

I'm going to have to order this online now as nowhere here (Bath) stocks it

In the meantime, whilst Purchasing Mojo, I would love to hear these tracks!!

Who wrote the article(s)? I was hoping Sylvie Simmons would be doing it, although it doesn't bode well if one of the quotes has been lifted from the 'Autobiography'

[desmondo]

There is another thing in the MOJO piece - a panel by Dominic in which he sets out his 10 musical stops to SMile

It includes Malibu Sunset, Moon Dawg, Lonely Sea, In The Back of My Mind....... Summer Means New Love, TLGIOK, and Pet Sounds

Under Summer Means New Love

"A refreshing pause after the amped up YSGTM : just as the vibes on Smile's Workshop cool the pace after Fire." - cough cough - discuss

[desmondo]

And that BW/VDP Elements quote

"When we started Smile, VDP told me that there were going to be nature elements like fire water earth and air. He said, "We can do a little of each"".

Brian also says VDP helped him a little with the music

Reason for junking it - "only snippets ........ incomplete songs"

[buddhahat]

"A refreshing pause after the amped up YSGTM : just as the vibes on Smile's Workshop cool the pace after Fire." - cough cough - discuss

I think I'm one of the few that buys Priore's theory here. I think the last "thud, thud thud" drum beats of Fire move perfectly into Friday Night/Workshop. I also love the contrast of dark and scary into light and humorous - seems like the sort of juxtaposition that Brian would've intended.

 I remember when I first put them together after reading Dom's Smile book  I thought "well, that's obviously how those songs were supposed to be sequenced", and they still sound 'right' to me to this day.

I don't doubt Carol Kaye has been liberal with the truth when it comes to which sessions she's played on, but for her to come out and say these two pieces belonged together - there's no motivation for that. It could obviously be a mistake on her part, but they do sound great together so bit of a coiincidence if it is an error. Don't the times add up to an overall time for Fire listed somewhere on a session log or something as well? I don't have Dom's book to hand, but I thought the evidence was pretty compelling when I originally read it.

[desmondo]

"A refreshing pause after the amped up YSGTM : just as the vibes on Smile's Workshop cool the pace after Fire." - cough cough - discuss

I think I'm one of the few that buys Priore's theory here. I think the last "thud, thud thud" drum beats of Fire move perfectly into Friday Night/Workshop. I also love the contrast of dark and scary into light and humorous - seems like the sort of juxtaposition that Brian would've intended.

 I remember when I first put them together after reading Dom's Smile book  I thought "well, that's obviously how those songs were supposed to be sequenced", and they still sound 'right' to me to this day.

Yep me too - on my Smile mix ( i use the 2004 versions) Workshop sounds just right after MOC - I have also put IIGS back into H&V along with BY and OMP/YAMS and the cantina making it 8:15 

[buddhahat]

"A refreshing pause after the amped up YSGTM : just as the vibes on Smile's Workshop cool the pace after Fire." - cough cough - discuss

I think I'm one of the few that buys Priore's theory here. I think the last "thud, thud thud" drum beats of Fire move perfectly into Friday Night/Workshop. I also love the contrast of dark and scary into light and humorous - seems like the sort of juxtaposition that Brian would've intended.

 I remember when I first put them together after reading Dom's Smile book  I thought "well, that's obviously how those songs were supposed to be sequenced", and they still sound 'right' to me to this day.

Yep me too - on my Smile mix ( i use the 2004 versions) Workshop sounds just right after MOC - I have also put IIGS back into H&V along with BY and OMP/YAMS and the cantina making it 8:15  

That Heroes sounds like a winner to me!

Here's the section form the Priore book. I'd be interested to hear opinions on the validity of the following info, beyond the obvious "Don't trust Carol Kaye":

During the 1966 sessions however Brian had informed studio bass player Carol Kaye that 'I Wanna Be Around' and 'Workshop' had been put together as a 'rebuilding after the fire' - a coda. In 1988, Wilson also mentioned to Andy Paley that the musical reference of Johnny Mercer's song 'I Wanna Be Around' was specifically used to invoke the lyrical phrase 'I wanna be around to pick up the pieces of our broken love affair' - that is to say, picking up the pieces after the fire. In two places, and in two different eras, Brian had laid down clues to collaborators that the I Wanna Be Around/Workshop combination was a cool-out and reconstruction after 'Mrs O'Learys Cow'.

A check with the sessions worksheets shows that the original timing of 'Mrs O'Leary's Cow' was to be 2 minutes & 50 seconds, and that the two pieces of it - 'Fire (1:50) and 'I Wanna Be Around'/Workshop' (1:30) - added up to just over 3 minutes, minus any fades or mixdowns. These two sections of Mrs O Leary's Cow were recorded on consecutive days: 28 and 29 November 1966.

[seanmurd]

Thanks to a friendly forum member -- I never even asked for a PM! -- I've been able to listen to both of the tracks a dozen times this morning. "Wonderful" sounds great, and I think the brief "yodel-ay-ee-hoo" vocals fit perfectly; otherwise, it does sound pretty identical to the GV box. "Cabin Essence" is, in my best guess, a new mono mix and NOT a fold-down or a single-channel fake-mono track. The "smoking gun" for me is Mike's "over and over, the crow flies..." vocals -- they sound completely different than the 20/20 vocals (perhaps just single-tracked like the lead vocal?), and they are boosted quite a bit, especially at the beginning of the line. Compare the 20/20 mix with the MOJO mix -- just Mike's "crow flies" part -- and it's almost undeniable that this is a genuine new mono mix.

[buddhahat]

I'm no expert at identifying what's been mixed, how and where, but I can hear what you're saying - that crow cries lyric definitely sounds much clearer and more up front than on the existing mix.

[desmondo]

I've sent the two mixes to a mate who is an engineer to see what he has to say - but I think it is a new mono mix simply because plain EQing couldn't achieve the differences

[desmondo]

Here the guy who did the single cover art

http://www.art.co.uk/asp/search_do.asp/_/prints.htm?ui=FB547CF5E7CF4CF5951CA80787B81149&searchstring=sung%20kim

[LostArt]

Does Wonderful end abruptly as it does on the 93 box, with the bass doing it's 'in between verses' thing, and then just ending, or does it fade?

[buddhahat]

Does Wonderful end abruptly as it does on the 93 box, with the bass doing it's 'in between verses' thing, and then just ending, or does it fade?

It's the same quick fade over the ascending bass part as far as I can hear.

[seanmurd]

Does Wonderful end abruptly as it does on the 93 box, with the bass doing it's 'in between verses' thing, and then just ending, or does it fade?

Yes, the ending to "Wonderful" is virtually -- if not completely -- identical. I listened to that specifically, because a lot of times you can tell from the fade if a song's been remixed or not.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Here's the section form the Priore book. I'd be interested to hear opinions on the validity of the following info, beyond the obvious "Don't trust Carol Kaye":

During the 1966 sessions however Brian had informed studio bass player Carol Kaye that 'I Wanna Be Around' and 'Workshop' had been put together as a 'rebuilding after the fire' - a coda. In 1988, Wilson also mentioned to Andy Paley that the musical reference of Johnny Mercer's song 'I Wanna Be Around' was specifically used to invoke the lyrical phrase 'I wanna be around to pick up the pieces of our broken love affair' - that is to say, picking up the pieces after the fire. In two places, and in two different eras, Brian had laid down clues to collaborators that the I Wanna Be Around/Workshop combination was a cool-out and reconstruction after 'Mrs O'Learys Cow'.

A check with the sessions worksheets shows that the original timing of 'Mrs O'Leary's Cow' was to be 2 minutes & 50 seconds, and that the two pieces of it - 'Fire (1:50) and 'I Wanna Be Around'/Workshop' (1:30) - added up to just over 3 minutes, minus any fades or mixdowns. These two sections of Mrs O Leary's Cow were recorded on consecutive days: 28 and 29 November 1966.

But... this info contradicts itself. Yes, the 11/28/66 session for "The Elements (Fire)" has the track logged at 2.50. No argument. But the following days session for "Friday Night (I'm in Great Shape)" is not only a different session, it doesn't share the master number for "Fire". Plus, 1.50 and 1.30 adds up to 3.20, which isn't even close to 2.50 (it's over 17% more). Sorry Orville, doesn't fly.

[desmondo]

Does Wonderful end abruptly as it does on the 93 box, with the bass doing it's 'in between verses' thing, and then just ending, or does it fade?

It's the same quick fade over the ascending bass part as far as I can hear.

If you listen carefully it fades but the bass continues in the background on its own (ready for SFC lolol)

[Andrew G. Doe]

Well, it's obviously not a fold-down... and I have my doubts it's a new mix, 'cause if it was, I'm they'd have come up with a mono doubled lead. I'm standing by what I theorised (until proven wrong) - it's a re-EQ'd left pan of the stereo master. If only because nothing else fits. 

Hmmm... interesting. Just OOPSed the album track, and, allowing for  1968 tinkering and mastering the only truly full stereo element is Carl's lead. The track is mono and the bvs appear to be treated with lashings of reverb to give a stereo effect.

Where's Steve Desper when you need him ?

[LostArt]

Does Wonderful end abruptly as it does on the 93 box, with the bass doing it's 'in between verses' thing, and then just ending, or does it fade?

Yes, the ending to "Wonderful" is virtually -- if not completely -- identical. I listened to that specifically, because a lot of times you can tell from the fade if a song's been remixed or not.

That's why I asked.  Thanks!

[desmondo]

Well, it's obviously not a fold-down... and I have my doubts it's a new mix, 'cause if it was, I'm they'd have come up with a mono doubled lead. I'm standing by what I theorised (until proven wrong) - it's a re-EQ'd left pan of the stereo master. If only because nothing else fits. 

Hmmm -sorry Andrew but I respectfully disagree cos

1. the stereo lead may not actually be properly double tracked but rather the same track just done left and right and with one slightly delayed for stereo purposes - just one take - I know this from experience

2. Just re-EQ'd left pan? - to be honest that's just plain lazy and would be an aural insult to the song - I doubt ML and AB would just do that for the sake of their own reputations

3. I think I am right in saying that the backing track was edited together from the various sessions for each part and then the backing vocals were put on top of the assembled backing track and then finally the lead vocal was done - I believe to be able to make the changes in the MOJO mix they must have access to some multitracks - wasn't the backing track locked into one or two tracks and the vocals filled up the next five or six with space left for the lead - that would allow Mark and Alan the opportunity to properly create a mono mix from the multitracks - I don't think the changes are as a result of just applying different EQ to the completed mix - the levels are just to different.

That said happy to be PROVED wrong by ML or AB

[seanmurd]

Well, it's obviously not a fold-down... and I have my doubts it's a new mix, 'cause if it was, I'm they'd have come up with a mono doubled lead. I'm standing by what I theorised (until proven wrong) - it's a re-EQ'd left pan of the stereo master. If only because nothing else fits. 

Hmmm... interesting. Just OOPSed the album track, and, allowing for  1968 tinkering and mastering the only truly full stereo element is Carl's lead. The track is mono and the bvs appear to be treated with lashings of reverb to give a stereo effect.

Where's Steve Desper when you need him ?

But Andrew, what about Mike's "crow cries" vocals? They absolutely sound different (and louder) on the MOJO single. Any thoughts?

[desmondo]

Does Wonderful end abruptly as it does on the 93 box, with the bass doing it's 'in between verses' thing, and then just ending, or does it fade?

Yes, the ending to "Wonderful" is virtually -- if not completely -- identical. I listened to that specifically, because a lot of times you can tell from the fade if a song's been remixed or not.

That's why I asked.  Thanks!

 I am hearing a couple of extra bass notes at the end on MOJO

[Iron Horse-Apples]

Please May I just say that I don't have a PhonographH Machine, so even when I Purchase Mojo I won't be able to Play My single.

I'll share my packed lunch with you!

I'm chomping at the bit to hear this.........

[Andrew G. Doe]

Well, it's obviously not a fold-down... and I have my doubts it's a new mix, 'cause if it was, I'm they'd have come up with a mono doubled lead. I'm standing by what I theorised (until proven wrong) - it's a re-EQ'd left pan of the stereo master. If only because nothing else fits. 

Hmmm... interesting. Just OOPSed the album track, and, allowing for  1968 tinkering and mastering the only truly full stereo element is Carl's lead. The track is mono and the bvs appear to be treated with lashings of reverb to give a stereo effect.

Where's Steve Desper when you need him ?

But Andrew, what about Mike's "crow cries" vocals? They absolutely sound different (and louder) on the MOJO single. Any thoughts?

I can't get past the fact that if it is a new mono mix, why the single lead ? Even in the world of the BB, and taking into account who's running the board, simply doesn't make sense. Time for a well-directed email, methinks.

DONG ! Lightbulb moment.  What if it always was a single lead ?  Can you say "ADT" ?

[desmondo]

Well, it's obviously not a fold-down... and I have my doubts it's a new mix, 'cause if it was, I'm they'd have come up with a mono doubled lead. I'm standing by what I theorised (until proven wrong) - it's a re-EQ'd left pan of the stereo master. If only because nothing else fits. 

Hmmm... interesting. Just OOPSed the album track, and, allowing for  1968 tinkering and mastering the only truly full stereo element is Carl's lead. The track is mono and the bvs appear to be treated with lashings of reverb to give a stereo effect.

Where's Steve Desper when you need him ?

But Andrew, what about Mike's "crow cries" vocals? They absolutely sound different (and louder) on the MOJO single. Any thoughts?

I can't get past the fact that if it is a new mono mix, why the single lead ? Even in the world of the BB, and taking into account who's running the board, simply doesn't make sense. Time for a well-directed email, methinks.

DONG ! Lightbulb moment.  What if it always was a single lead ?  Can you say "ADT" ?

The MOJO mix lead could still be double tracked but because it is in mono it will be very very subtle

Listening on headphones - most of sounds like a single track but more so for the first half of each verse - the second half sounds slightly different to me - some more reverb or subtle double track

Also we have to remember that in 1968 SD and CW were creating a stereo mix from some thing that was supposed to be in mono?? - SD+CW is not Chuck Britz+Brian

[seanmurd]

But Andrew, what about Mike's "crow cries" vocals? They absolutely sound different (and louder) on the MOJO single. Any thoughts?

I can't get past the fact that if it is a new mono mix, why the single lead ? Even in the world of the BB, and taking into account who's running the board, simply doesn't make sense. Time for a well-directed email, methinks.

DONG ! Lightbulb moment.  What if it always was a single lead ?  Can you say "ADT" ?

Yes -- ADT was my first guess too, mainly because it SOUNDS double-tracked, but there are no noticeable differences between the "two" leads. No vocalist is THAT perfect -- not even a Beach Boy! But back to the Mike "crow cries" vocals -- this is the most glaringly obvious difference between the 20/20 mix and the MOJO mix. I've listened to both channels of the stereo mix individually, in mono, and in both cases Mike's vocals are quite buried in the track. On the MOJO version, he's right on top, clearer than ever before. I don't think it's just EQ. What else would explain it other than a new mix?