Don't Fight the Sea / Friends (A Capella)

[hypehat]

Oh, and Don't Fight The Sea is some kind of unfettered musical genius?

Just because it has all the Beach Boys on it in some capacity doesn't make it good! As attested by the fact the song itself is limp, the production cheesy, and the lyrics banal in the extreme.

And for all the things you mention, vintagemusic, it's NOT a new beach Boys song. It's Al Jardine grabbing headlines for his crap solo record.

Sounds like a Brianista talking here. DFTS may not be a new song by age, but it is new to us. You write this post like your opinion is the only one that matters. Some of us like it and it does matter to us. I'm 54 and have listened to a lot of music produced in the late 70's and 80's and DFTS is no cheesier than half the stuff recorded in that period. The 45 is for charity and not for grabbing headlines. Except for a few online articles, I've seen very little of Al Jardine drawing the spotlight on himself. If you don't like it, tha's fine, but do you really hate it that much? I'm interested because I feel that songs like "When Girls Get Together" or "California Calling" are far more below caliber than DFTS. At least DFTS has some really terrific vocals on it.

@surfriderhawaii
Gershwin is not merda. I think history has proved that. Again, why does one thing need to be ripped in order to get a point across on another? Start a new thread if you want to talk about something other than Smile.

So I came on a little strong. It was somewhere inbetween being told I didn't 'get' the Brian-less music (as if, he's all over the damn place on those songs) of Friends, Sunflower, etc just cos I don't like 'Don't Fight The Sea' that I decided to get mad.

Brianista? No. I am not slavishly devoted to his music. I don't just like music because it features The Beach Boys = Carl's singing? It's fantastic! Which seems to be surfriderhawaii's argument.

Sorry to offend Dr, but I guess i just have a low tolerance for the eighties music. It's below par, in my opinion.

I shall go so far to say that not only are The Beach Boys the best band I've ever heard, they are also the worst.

[drbeachboy]

 @tansen.   
 I hear no production issues on DFTS. I've played this for family, friends and some co-workers and all liked it and said they knew who it was as soon they started singing. I know, Brian didn't write it, so it can't have much merit.

[drbeachboy]

@hypehat

I understand where you are coming from, and thanks for the answer. I tend to get past a lot of second rate songs, because they can take just about any sh*t song and make it sound beautiful with their voices. Those voices together are pure magic to these ears.

[SurfRiderHawaii]

@tansen.   
 I hear no production issues on DFTS. I've played this for family, friends and some co-workers and all liked it and said they knew who it was as soon they started singing. I know, Brian didn't write it, so it can't have much merit.

I think it's first rate!  The reggae section is very cool!

What's a shame is that the BB could have had a killer album in the early 80's.  Just take "DFTS", "Looking Down the Coast" and "California Dreamin" - Al had 25% of a really good album covered.  Guess the trouble is, as a producer, he's a turtle.

[Jim V.]

Oh, and Don't Fight The Sea is some kind of unfettered musical genius?

Just because it has all the Beach Boys on it in some capacity doesn't make it good! As attested by the fact the song itself is limp, the production cheesy, and the lyrics banal in the extreme.

And for all the things you mention, vintagemusic, it's NOT a new beach Boys song. It's Al Jardine grabbing headlines for his crap solo record.

Sounds like a Brianista talking here. DFTS may not be a new song by age, but it is new to us. You write this post like your opinion is the only one that matters. Some of us like it and it does matter to us. I'm 54 and have listened to a lot of music produced in the late 70's and 80's and DFTS is no cheesier than half the stuff recorded in that period. The 45 is for charity and not for grabbing headlines. Except for a few online articles, I've seen very little of Al Jardine drawing the spotlight on himself. If you don't like it, tha's fine, but do you really hate it that much? I'm interested because I feel that songs like "When Girls Get Together" or "California Calling" are far more below caliber than DFTS. At least DFTS has some really terrific vocals on it.

@surfriderhawaii
Gershwin is not merda. I think history has proved that. Again, why does one thing need to be ripped in order to get a point across on another? Start a new thread if you want to talk about something other than Smile.

I agree with your DFTS thoughts exactly!

But I dare you to listen to "King for a Day" and then Gershwin.  Night and day diff.  Anyone who loved Brian's pre-74 voice 'has' to cringe on Gershwin.  Al could have done the same exact album and it would have sound 1000% better.   Gershwin just sounds 'canned', totally predicable.  PAPA DOO RUN RUN coulda done it.

Gershwin was a nice idea but there's a reason most reviews were mediocre or poor.  You're right, not Merda but just bores the hell out of me.

I don't wanna make this a thread about Brian's singing voice, but I would WAY rather have Brian's singing over Al. He sounds great on "The Like In I Love You". And nearly the whole album he sounds really good. Sure he doesn't sound like 1967 Brian, but he definitely has that same lovely tone he has on "Please Let Me Wonder" on things like "'S Wonderful", "I've Got a Crush on You" and some others. He sucked on Orange Crate Art and Gettin' In Over My Head, and the BWPS songs were a bit too much for him, but he still is a good singer these days when he takes his time.

[SurfRiderHawaii]

Oh, and Don't Fight The Sea is some kind of unfettered musical genius?

Just because it has all the Beach Boys on it in some capacity doesn't make it good! As attested by the fact the song itself is limp, the production cheesy, and the lyrics banal in the extreme.

And for all the things you mention, vintagemusic, it's NOT a new beach Boys song. It's Al Jardine grabbing headlines for his crap solo record.

Sounds like a Brianista talking here. DFTS may not be a new song by age, but it is new to us. You write this post like your opinion is the only one that matters. Some of us like it and it does matter to us. I'm 54 and have listened to a lot of music produced in the late 70's and 80's and DFTS is no cheesier than half the stuff recorded in that period. The 45 is for charity and not for grabbing headlines. Except for a few online articles, I've seen very little of Al Jardine drawing the spotlight on himself. If you don't like it, tha's fine, but do you really hate it that much? I'm interested because I feel that songs like "When Girls Get Together" or "California Calling" are far more below caliber than DFTS. At least DFTS has some really terrific vocals on it.

@surfriderhawaii
Gershwin is not merda. I think history has proved that. Again, why does one thing need to be ripped in order to get a point across on another? Start a new thread if you want to talk about something other than Smile.

I agree with your DFTS thoughts exactly!

But I dare you to listen to "King for a Day" and then Gershwin.  Night and day diff.  Anyone who loved Brian's pre-74 voice 'has' to cringe on Gershwin.  Al could have done the same exact album and it would have sound 1000% better.   Gershwin just sounds 'canned', totally predicable.  PAPA DOO RUN RUN coulda done it.

Gershwin was a nice idea but there's a reason most reviews were mediocre or poor.  You're right, not Merda but just bores the hell out of me.

I don't wanna make this a thread about Brian's singing voice, but I would WAY rather have Brian's singing over Al. He sounds great on "The Like In I Love You". And nearly the whole album he sounds really good. Sure he doesn't sound like 1967 Brian, but he definitely has that same lovely tone he has on "Please Let Me Wonder" on things like "'S Wonderful", "I've Got a Crush on You" and some others. He sucked on Orange Crate Art and Gettin' In Over My Head, and the BWPS songs were a bit too much for him, but he still is a good singer these days when he takes his time.

A. You are obviously unaware of Brian's pre "15 Big One's" voice
B. Better than Al now - wow, you are smokin the wacky wacky
C. Pro Tools and "Auto tune"
D. Brian does sing better than I do, that's for sure.

[tansen]

@tansen.  
 I hear no production issues on DFTS. I've played this for family, friends and some co-workers and all liked it and said they knew who it was as soon they started singing. I know, Brian didn't write it, so it can't have much merit.

I don't think I said anything about production, but I'm no big fan of the 80's type production on Don't Fight the Sea, that's true. But honestly, I don't give a crap who wrote the song, a good song is a good song. Period. And as a songwriter/musician myself, it just ain't enough with some smooth voices covering over a bad song. Of course, a lot of the times this goes the other way too, but I'm more susceptible to like a song that has 'weird' or different vocals, as long as its good songwriting. I mean, take Dylan or Neil Young, not the greatest voices in the world, but dang, they have some incredible songs.
That being said, I'm having real trouble listening to Brian's solo work, and that is mostly because of his singing voice.

[tansen]

@tansen.   
 I hear no production issues on DFTS. I've played this for family, friends and some co-workers and all liked it and said they knew who it was as soon they started singing. I know, Brian didn't write it, so it can't have much merit.

I think it's first rate!  The reggae section is very cool!

What's a shame is that the BB could have had a killer album in the early 80's.  Just take "DFTS", "Looking Down the Coast" and "California Dreamin" - Al had 25% of a really good album covered.  Guess the trouble is, as a producer, he's a turtle.

I think, 'killer' is stretching it a bit far. I can't stand BB's version of "California Dreamin'" - I mean the original is sooo good. Looking down the coast is quite ok, better than DFTS, but no masterpiece. And also, I have to say that i think the demo of California Feeling from the 70's is better than Al's new version. Again, this has to do with vocals - Carls lead is great on this track.

[tansen]

Oh, and Don't Fight The Sea is some kind of unfettered musical genius?

Just because it has all the Beach Boys on it in some capacity doesn't make it good! As attested by the fact the song itself is limp, the production cheesy, and the lyrics banal in the extreme.

And for all the things you mention, vintagemusic, it's NOT a new beach Boys song. It's Al Jardine grabbing headlines for his crap solo record.

Sounds like a Brianista talking here. DFTS may not be a new song by age, but it is new to us. You write this post like your opinion is the only one that matters. Some of us like it and it does matter to us. I'm 54 and have listened to a lot of music produced in the late 70's and 80's and DFTS is no cheesier than half the stuff recorded in that period. The 45 is for charity and not for grabbing headlines. Except for a few online articles, I've seen very little of Al Jardine drawing the spotlight on himself. If you don't like it, tha's fine, but do you really hate it that much? I'm interested because I feel that songs like "When Girls Get Together" or "California Calling" are far more below caliber than DFTS. At least DFTS has some really terrific vocals on it.

@surfriderhawaii
Gershwin is not merda. I think history has proved that. Again, why does one thing need to be ripped in order to get a point across on another? Start a new thread if you want to talk about something other than Smile.

I agree with your DFTS thoughts exactly!

But I dare you to listen to "King for a Day" and then Gershwin.  Night and day diff.  Anyone who loved Brian's pre-74 voice 'has' to cringe on Gershwin.  Al could have done the same exact album and it would have sound 1000% better.   Gershwin just sounds 'canned', totally predicable.  PAPA DOO RUN RUN coulda done it.

Gershwin was a nice idea but there's a reason most reviews were mediocre or poor.  You're right, not Merda but just bores the hell out of me.

I don't wanna make this a thread about Brian's singing voice, but I would WAY rather have Brian's singing over Al. He sounds great on "The Like In I Love You". And nearly the whole album he sounds really good. Sure he doesn't sound like 1967 Brian, but he definitely has that same lovely tone he has on "Please Let Me Wonder" on things like "'S Wonderful", "I've Got a Crush on You" and some others. He sucked on Orange Crate Art and Gettin' In Over My Head, and the BWPS songs were a bit too much for him, but he still is a good singer these days when he takes his time.

A. You are obviously unaware of Brian's pre "15 Big One's" voice
B. Better than Al now - wow, you are smokin the wacky wacky
C. Pro Tools and "Auto tune"
D. Brian does sing better than I do, that's for sure.

I'm with you here man. No one with any sense of musicality can claim that Brian's voice (now) is better than Al's. I mean, there is no contest here. And you're right, Brian's latest studio efforts have Autotune/Melodyne all over them. D: You must have a none-existing singing voice in that case

[Sam_BFC]

There were reports at the time of BWRG's release that it did not feature any autotune on Brian's voice IIRC.

[SurfRiderHawaii]

There were reports at the time of BWRG's release that it did not feature any autotune on Brian's voice IIRC.

And the moon is made of cheese.

[hypehat]

Care to point out an example? Of the moon, or BWRG's autotune?

[tansen]

Care to point out an example? Of the moon, or BWRG's autotune?

Just remember there's a difference between autotune and tuning a vocal. There is no doubt that Brian's voice has been tuned at times - just like with any other artist these days.

[hypehat]

I said, give me an example.

[tansen]

I said, give me an example.

Don't get cheeky with me. Tuned vocals are all over the album. Giving an example of tuned vocals would be to give an example of drums and bass being 'beatmapped' (e.g. making sure they're in time in the editing process by quantizing to grid/an instrument  - elastic audio being one of Pro Tools' way of doing it). If it's done well, you can't really tell.

[hypehat]

yeah, but that's very easy to say. I'm asking you to point one out to me, and you seem incapable. Fine.

By the time I've edited this we'll probably be onto the next post.

Then don't turn around and say Brian has a 'none-existent voice' because he's doing something every Tom, Dick and Harry does on his record, then! WTF.

[tansen]

yeah, but that's very easy to say. I'm asking you to point one out to me, and you seem incapable. Fine.

By the time I've edited this we'll probably be onto the next post.

Then don't turn around and say Brian has a 'none-existent voice' because he's doing something every Tom, Dick and Harry does on his record, then! WTF.

It's definitely hard to point out, because of the reasons explained above. But we have all heard him in concert, and there's not doubt he sings better on record than live. Of course this has to do with multiple takes. doubling, etc, but tuning vocals is pretty much something any engineer/producer will do today. Brian's vocal is no exception.

I didn't say Brian has a 'none existing voice', I said SurfRider does if Brian sings better than him. It was an exaggerating joke though.
Anyways, no need to get upset hypehat.

[hypehat]

Cool. It's been a long week. Let's not fight, although we can agree to disagree about DFTS 

[tansen]

Cool. It's been a long week. Let's not fight, although we can agree to disagree about DFTS 

Absolutely! Now, let's enjoy the weekend!

[MaxL]

Hoping to continue the peaceful vibes here:

Got this record and, since I don't own my own record player, had to wait till I visited my parents. I'm currently here listening to the a-side for the third consecutive time. Gotta say, I really enjoy it.

And obviously Friends (a Capella) is fantastic (though it's not ALL a capella...)

[tansen]

I still wish someone could 'rip' side B for me

[Wylson]

I think Brian's singing is quite good on BWRG, but there is clear use of post-production tuning of his vocal. Most obvious example I think is in 'The Like In I Love You', "the faith in faithful, the like in I love you" - can just hear that it isn't natural. Also suspect some manipulation on the higher parts of Rhapsody.

Most horrific use is on BWPS, on Surf's Up, eurgh...

[MaxL]

I still wish someone could 'rip' side B for me

Hopefully someone out there has a vinyl-to-Mp3 conversion-majig or some such sorcery.

In the meantime enjoy this short (oh so short) a capella rendition of "Friends", it's not much:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tilogc9K2Ag

[bgas]

I still wish someone could 'rip' side B for me

ALL $15 goes to the Red Cross/Japan, you should simply send away for it.

[tansen]

I still wish someone could 'rip' side B for me

ALL $15 goes to the Red Cross/Japan, you should simply send away for it.

Already bought it (if you read the first post in this thread), but have no vinyl player at the moment. A friend came to the rescue and just sent me the ripped version though - loving the a capella!