Mark Linett Billboard Interview About SMiLE

[Chocolate Shake Man]

Why does there have to be all four elements? Maybe it only got as far as Fire/Water.

These seem to be two different points so I will tackle them individually:

Why does there have to be all four elements?

There doesn't have to be, but it seems to be part of Brian's ambitious ethic at the time to record a suite that musically represented the four Elements in his style. The idea, after all, is located in Vivaldi's Four Seasons and Vivaldi didn't stop after only two concertos. I can't imagine that Brian would have wanted his Elements to only consist of half the elements.

Maybe it only got as far as Fire/Water.

I always thought this was indeed the case but, again, Linett says that all the music was recorded (which is really what led to this discussion). In that case, I'm curious what Linett means when he says that. Is he suggesting that all the music on BWPS can be found in the Smile Sessions? Is he saying that all the music for Brian's original Smile was recorded and the only thing he had left to do was complete the vocals and assemble the pieces? Is he saying they can locate all the music (ie. Part 2 of Surf's Up) in some shape or form, even if it wasn't officially recorded during the official studio sessions or simply cannot be located? Again, I just think this is an interesting quote to pursue.

[Dunderhead]

Fall breaks IS Fire. Same song. its not earth.

I'm not saying it's Earth, just that it sounds Earthy to me....but it is not Fire...(MOC)...It is Fall Breaks. However, could he not have used theme and variations for the Elements?

Brian said he wanted to record a candle instead of a fire. That's what Fall Breaks is, a candle compared to a fire. I don't think Brian conceived of Fall Breaks as Earth. There's no evidence of that, and considering that it reuses the music from Fire, I don't think it has any relation whatsoever to Earth.
It just doesn't make sense to connect the two.

Regarding The Elements.
What knowledge do we actually have of this track? Well there's the handwritten note with "The Elements" listed. But that's been shown again and again to have not been written by Brian. Right?
Then there's the session tapes of Fire that start with "The Elements, Part 1: Fire". So that suggests there were to be more parts.
Finally there is an interview with Brian where he is asked what "Air" was. Brian responds that it was an unfinished piano instrumental, something which has never been heard by anyone (unless Mark has discovered it while preparing this release). I've never heard any further context for this oft-quoted answer, but I simply don't think this quote is any sort of definite proof. This is just my opinion, based on how unreliable Brian's interview answers have been, especially when concerning SMiLE. He could have very well been telling the truth, but based on everything I've learned about Brian and about SMiLE, I have a serious doubt.

But beyond these three things, what else is there? Is there anything else we know about the track? On what grounds do we fans believe there were to be "Earth" and "Air" sections? On what grounds do we believe that the different "parts" of this song would have all been lumped together as a single track?

What's interesting to me is that Fire is titled not "The Elements Part One: Fire" but "Mrs. O'Leary's Fire" or "Mrs. O'Leary's Cow". The fact that this was to be the title places it along with Heroes and Villains and Cabinessence as songs about history and americana. What exists of Water does not have any connection like that, the Water material is simply "Water" and it does not even bear the same stamp as "The Elements, Part X" that Fire does. Certainly based on the handwritten tracklist (which we know was not written by Brian), we are tempted to conceive of a single elemental song. But based on the Goodbye Surfing article we know Brian planned to give Fire a separate title distinct from "The Elements", which suggests that there would NOT have been a single track named "The Elements".

Lets look at the general character of SMiLE. The central song of the whole project, Heroes and Villains, presents a duality. A conflict or battle between two opposing forces, the Heroes and the Villains. Cowboys and Indians, Cops and Robbers, The Hip and the UnHip. This was representative of the idea of Ying and Yang, which is undoubtedly in the realm of the new age spirituality influences of SMiLE. Do You Dig Worms? is not about Earth! It's about this duality of history! The line "Rock, Rock, Roll, Plymouth Rock Roll Over" says all you need to know about this song. Firstly there's the pun, "Rock, Rock, Roll" which has a double meaning saying both Plymouth Rock is being overturned, but it's also an invocation of Rock Music as a medium for social change. The power of Rock and Roll is in this case allowing us to clear the cobwebs of history! And what's underneath Plymouth Rock? The same thing as any rock! Worms!! These are the worms in the apple of history! The truth behind our built up historical illusions. The song is not about Earth at all, but rather about changing how we view "Heroes and Villains" in our own history, "Do You Dig Worms?" is asking us to take on a new perspective where the cowboys and the cops are Villains instead of Heroes, it's a reversal of things, a new way of conceptualizing our own pasts!

SMiLE having two opposing elements, Fire and Water would make sense then! How do Earth and Air fit into the duality scheme? I don't think they do. And I don't think there is any evidence that there was ever a Earth or Air section planned. SMiLE is all about duality, the contest of opposing forces.


What I think happened was Brian was basically talking a lot about doing Elemental instrumentals. Doing different tracks about Elements or whatever. Carl probably wrote the handwritten note off from memory after having hung around Brian during the sessions that he attended. he didn't really know how things would fit together so he just lumped them all into one thing, "The Elements". But on my own personal SMiLE mix I would put Fire on Side A along with Heroes and Villains. And I'd put water (Diamond Head I think is very close to what Brian originally envisioned for the Water track) on Side B.

But please, feel free to disagree and tell me all about it.


I'd also like to add my thought that Vega-Tables is not at all about Earth either. The Vegetables in the song are drugs. On the early version of Vegetables there are different lyrics. "Tripped on a cornucopia". There is no way that line is not about drugs. We're talking about 1966 here, this is a psychedelic album, and Van Dykes lyrics are so infused with puns that it's impossible to ignore this lines connection to LSD trips. Vega-Tables is not a song about Earth, it's a song about spiritual and physical well being as a gateway to personal growth and enlightenment. The vegetables are not only the type of health food Brian was interested in (He did own a Health Food store after all, didn't he?) but also about the use of drugs as a source of personal actualization. Brian likely removed this early lyric for the same reason he did "Hang on to your ego", he thought it was too blatant and second guessed himself.
The recurrent belief that Vega-Tables is about Earth confounds me. It's based on nothing other than the idea, "vegetables grow from the ground". I really don't buy that Vega-Tables was ever earth.

[Mr. Cohen]

What I think happened was Brian was basically talking a lot about doing Elemental instrumentals. Doing different tracks about Elements or whatever. Carl probably wrote the handwritten note off from memory after having hung around Brian during the sessions that he attended. he didn't really know how things would fit together so he just lumped them all into one thing, "The Elements". But on my own personal SMiLE mix I would put Fire on Side A along with Heroes and Villains. And I'd put water (Diamond Head I think is very close to what Brian originally envisioned for the Water track) on Side B.

There were people in Brian's circle at the time who described "The Elements" as a sort of 'opera', with the Chicago fire, which is then put out and followed by rebuilding. Which makes sense. You have "Fire", then "Water Chant" (presumably with some water sound effects), followed by "I Wanna Be Around/Workshop". Makes sense to me.

Brian said he wanted to record a candle instead of a fire. That's what Fall Breaks is, a candle compared to a fire. I don't think Brian conceived of Fall Breaks as Earth. There's no evidence of that, and considering that it reuses the music from Fire, I don't think it has any relation whatsoever to Earth.
It just doesn't make sense to connect the two.

Brian stated that he wanted to capture the changing of the seasons from Fall to Winter with that track. An explanation which makes perfect sense, as it's indicated in the title.

[Dunderhead]

What I think happened was Brian was basically talking a lot about doing Elemental instrumentals. Doing different tracks about Elements or whatever. Carl probably wrote the handwritten note off from memory after having hung around Brian during the sessions that he attended. he didn't really know how things would fit together so he just lumped them all into one thing, "The Elements". But on my own personal SMiLE mix I would put Fire on Side A along with Heroes and Villains. And I'd put water (Diamond Head I think is very close to what Brian originally envisioned for the Water track) on Side B.

There were people in Brian's circle at the time who described "The Elements" as a sort of 'opera', with the Chicago fire, which is then put out and followed by rebuilding. Which makes sense. You have "Fire", then "Water Chant" (presumably with some water sound effects), followed by "I Wanna Be Around/Workshop". Makes sense to me.

I think that's a stretch. Firstly that assumes that Carol Kaye was correct that I Wanna Be Around was Earth. This has been disputed to no end. This also precludes the idea that each element was to be an instrumental, which goes against what is most commonly assumed about the track.
Also why is there a song about The Great Chicago Fire on the part of the album not about American history?
Also what about Air? How would Air have fit into the sequence you described. Chicago burns, water puts out the fire, the city is rebuilt, then air! It doesn't really follow the logic.
Also what does "I Wanna Be Around" mean? What does it symbolize? It's a Sinatra song. Brian was into recycling "traditional" songs. The reason he was doing this was because he wanted to weave a tapestry of American musical styles. That's what the "Americana" section is about. Which is why I do not think that bit was supposed to be part The Elements at all. I think Fire, if it was on the A-side, might have been followed by I Wanna Be Around. But I don't think it was Earth. It doesn't really fit in does it? It doesn't seem to have anything to do with Earth other than I guess, building things is "earthy", but that doesn't sound right. The connection just isn't there. This was a list of influences that was posted in another thread by Big Grin:

- "Gee" by The Crows/Jan & Dean
- "El Paso" by Marty Robbins
- "Peace In The Valley" by The Patuxent Partners
- "Roll Columbia Roll (Gran Coulee Dam)" by Woody Guthrie
- "Old Mc Donald" various versions
- "Barnyard Blues" by Original Dixieland Jazz Band
- "The Old Master Painter" by Dick Haymes
- "You Are My Sunshine" by Jimmie Davis
- "Waiting for a train" by Jimmie Rodgers
- "I've been working on the railroad" by The Tinseltown Players
- "Home on the range" by Gene Autry/Roy Rodgers
- "Frere Jacques/Brother John" by Fred Koch
- "Long Ago Tomorrow" by Burt Bacharach
- "I Wanna Be Around" by Julie London
- "In Old Chicago" (the story of Mrs O Leary's Cow) 1937 MOVIE by Henry King *
- "Cool Water" by The Sons Of The Pioneers
- "Blue Hawaii" by Henri Mancini/Elvis Presley
- "Ukulele Lady" by Duke Kamoku
- "The Pirates Of Penzance: I'm A Pirate King" by D'Oyly Carte Opera Company And Orchestra
- "Long Long Ago" by Jerry Gray And His Orchestra/Ellen & John Wright

"I Wanna Be Around" fits into these other songs, into Old Master Painter, into You Are My Sunshine, into all the traditional influences you can see on the Heroes and Villains material.
 
That's the overarching concept of "The SMiLE Shop" the SMiLE shop sells Smiles. The Smile Shop is a Record Store a Health Food Store and a Book Store all rolled into one. The Americana section of SMiLE is styled on a record store! The hyper-literate lyrics are styled as a tapestry of references to American literature.

The A-Side of SMiLE would have been a history lesson. A trip around the record store. A walk down the isles of a book store. It covers the past, the influences, the makeup of American cultural history. It would have been an extended medley of sections all copping from "traditional" American music and literature.

[Mr. Cohen]

Right, well, I'm just saying that "I Wanna Be Around" works as a musical pun... "I wanna be around to pick up the pieces when somebody breaks your heart". Then you get the hammers and nails. Obviously, it makes no sense as an "earth" element, but I'm just going with the mini-opera idea Brian's friends were talking about.

[Dunderhead]

Yeah it makes sense following Fire. But if we assume that The Elements was a single track that had four parts, one for each element, than how could I Wanna Be Around come after Fire??? It just doesn't work. That's why the theory that I Wanna Be Around would come after Fire actually fits nicely into my theory that Fire and Water would have been separate tracks. Right?

Also please share the interview with us about the opera idea. I'd love to read it.

[Mr. Cohen]

I wish I could. I used to be a member of rocksbackpages.com, & I read tons of interviews. Alas, I no longer have a membership.

[bossaroo]

if windchimes is air, then it makes sense that it comes before fire. fire can't exist without air after all.

and the tag on windchimes starts very softly with just piano, then turns into a huge cacophany... similar to a windstorm.

this is similar to the candle or lamp leading to a raging inferno.



I'd really like to see SMiLE made into an animated film a la Fantasia...

[Chocolate Shake Man]

Fishmonk - thanks for the Elements info. I had forgotten a lot of it and hadn't seen much of it before.

I should say that I do like your idea of dualism in the album but I have a bit of a different perspective. The dualism, for example, that is established in Heroes and Villains is subverted in Do You Like Worms. After all the traditional "heroes" and "villains" in American mythology (which indeed is played up in H&V) are typically cowboys and Indians. But Do You Like Worms make us aware of a counter-narrative of American history in which the heroes have practically destroyed the "church of the American Indian". In other words, who are the heroes? Is it so clear cut as Heroes/Villains? Or can there be such a thing as a Hero/Villain? In that sense, Parks rather brilliantly undermines the idea of dualism.

Consequently, I think the preoccupation of the lyrical content of the album is in de-mythologizing American history - Parks essentially makes this very point in Brian's A&E Biography. The Beach Boys, as the all-American band subvert the American story from within. The pilgrims of Plymouth Rock who displace the Natives take us to the subversion of New England-derived Puritanism of Wonderful. Cabinessence, of course, matches the tranquility of white settlers in the gold belt with the exploited Chinese workers "who ran the iron horse" that allowed for Westward travel and enormous riches for particularly groups of the population. Smile in many ways takes apart Manifest Destiny and reveals the erased stories that really drove American history. By revising US history, Parks and Wilson in effect "uncover the cornfield" by exposing the side of history we rarely (by 1966 standards when, say, scholars vastly underestimated the amount of Natives who died at the hands of European imperialism) see. As Love sings the coda to Cabinessence, we can hear an Asian melody just leaking through the Mark Twain-ish banjo and harmonica. This, I think, nicely sums up the lyrical thrust of the album.

Now, what does this have to do with The Elements? Well, not much. A good part of the album was equally invested in musical innovation by Brian too. Our Prayer was a contemporary hymn and The Elements, I think, was another part of this new way of thinking about pop music.

And, yes, I would imagine that at the very least Brian wrote all four parts or had an idea of what he wanted them all to be even if he never got around to recording all of them.

And while we're at it, what is the consensus of Surf's Up Pt. 2? It MUST have been recorded, right?

[All Golden 74]

... tag on windchimes starts very softly with just piano, then turns into a huge cacophany... similar to a windstorm...

I've always thought this was a good candidate for the Air element - Brian said that Air was just a piano piece with no vocals.  He also said that they never finished it.  Maybe he meant that it was never finished production/mixing wise.  He might have wanted to tweak it with sound effects or something.  Anyhow, several very knowledgeable people on this board have shined this whole idea (about the "Wind Chimes" tag being the Air element).  Heck, they know better n' me!

[Dunderhead]

Fishmonk - thanks for the Elements info. I had forgotten a lot of it and hadn't seen much of it before.

I should say that I do like your idea of dualism in the album but I have a bit of a different perspective. The dualism, for example, that is established in Heroes and Villains is subverted in Do You Like Worms. After all the traditional "heroes" and "villains" in American mythology (which indeed is played up in H&V) are typically cowboys and Indians. But Do You Like Worms make us aware of a counter-narrative of American history in which the heroes have practically destroyed the "church of the American Indian". In other words, who are the heroes? Is it so clear cut as Heroes/Villains? Or can there be such a thing as a Hero/Villain? In that sense, Parks rather brilliantly undermines the idea of dualism.

Consequently, I think the preoccupation of the lyrical content of the album is in de-mythologizing American history - Parks essentially makes this very point in Brian's A&E Biography. The Beach Boys, as the all-American band subvert the American story from within. The pilgrims of Plymouth Rock who displace the Natives take us to the subversion of New England-derived Puritanism of Wonderful. Cabinessence, of course, matches the tranquility of white settlers in the gold belt with the exploited Chinese workers "who ran the iron horse" that allowed for Westward travel and enormous riches for particularly groups of the population. Smile in many ways takes apart Manifest Destiny and reveals the erased stories that really drove American history. By revising US history, Parks and Wilson in effect "uncover the cornfield" by exposing the side of history we rarely (by 1966 standards when, say, scholars vastly underestimated the amount of Natives who died at the hands of European imperialism) see. As Love sings the coda to Cabinessence, we can hear an Asian melody just leaking through the Mark Twain-ish banjo and harmonica. This, I think, nicely sums up the lyrical thrust of the album.

Now, what does this have to do with The Elements? Well, not much. A good part of the album was equally invested in musical innovation by Brian too. Our Prayer was a contemporary hymn and The Elements, I think, was another part of this new way of thinking about pop music.

And, yes, I would imagine that at the very least Brian wrote all four parts or had an idea of what he wanted them all to be even if he never got around to recording all of them.

And while we're at it, what is the consensus of Surf's Up Pt. 2? It MUST have been recorded, right?

Yeah, you're certainly right on.
But even in Cabinessence there is dualism. The dualism between the past and the future. The traditional atmosphere of the verses and the locomotive industrialization of the "chorus". Past and future, Heroes and Villains, Fire and Water.
And where do past and future meet? The present. To me THAT'S the subversion of the dualism idea. The idea that opposition is not really opposition. That even thought we have these two things that appear to be complete opposites, in reality they are totally interconnected and dependent on eachother.

This is psychedelic philosophy 101. Check out Alan Watts' book The Book On The Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are. I'm certain that Brian had read this book, all you have to do is read the Goodbye Surfing... article. Brian echoes exactly the sentiment of the book in his description of Surf's Up at the end of that article. He practically quotes from it. What is the book about? The book talks about how dualities are connected to eacother. That you can't have life without death. You can't have matter without space. You can't have sound without silence. etc. etc. etc.

This is the "idea" of SMiLE! Not just a subversion of dualities, but the uniting of opposites. Just how past and future unite in the present.
 

[guitarfool2002]

Just wanted to chime in on "Fall Breaks...". It's not Fire, instead there was even a rumored piece of tape where Brian says something about walking through the snow while recording "Fall Breaks". Plus, a mid-90's interview where he talks about the track, if I could find it I think he mentions the changing seasons (or I could be remembering it wrong...).

[armona]

Brian said that Air was just a piano piece with no vocals.  He also said that they never finished it.  Maybe he meant that it was never finished production/mixing wise.  He might have wanted to tweak it with sound effects or something.

I think it must have been more embryonic than that: Brian's comment about Air jibes well with what Anderle said in '67: "We were aware, he made us aware, of what fire was going to be, and what water was going to be; we had some idea of air. That was where it stopped. None of us had any ideas as to how it was going to tie together, except that it appeared to us to be an opera."

[Dunderhead]

Just wanted to chime in on "Fall Breaks...". It's not Fire, instead there was even a rumored piece of tape where Brian says something about walking through the snow while recording "Fall Breaks". Plus, a mid-90's interview where he talks about the track, if I could find it I think he mentions the changing seasons (or I could be remembering it wrong...).

In any event it's not Earth. Just a reused SMiLE bit for a new song, new concept NOT related to The Elements.

Interestingly, Brian's comment about Air jibes well with what Anderle said in '67: "We were aware, he made us aware, of what fire was going to be, and what water was going to be; we had some idea of air. That was where it stopped. None of us had any ideas as to how it was going to tie together, except that it appeared to us to be an opera."

Isn't that the same article where David says Dennis was originally supposed to sing Cabinessence, like some "funky cat" (is the term I think he uses) in the mountains.
There's just a lot of information circulating around, and I think I remember a thread where AGD had some factual issues with the information in that Anderle article. So it's really hard to get everything we've heard to jive with eachother. From that quote it's really hard to make sense of what that Opera comment was actually talking about, and the way he puts it "appeared to us" suggests that the idea was not of Brian's design but rather Anderle's interpretation. Maybe he's right maybe not. But it's certainly not much to go on.

Again, I have to question the quote about the "unfinished piano piece". Seems really suspect to me. Just a vague rumor that's been floating around for years. When was that quote from, what interview was it in? Who was talking to him? I could be totally wrong, but I have the vague notion that the information was told to a fan over the telephone or something, so to me, it's just very questionable how accurate the statement is.

If "Unfinished Air Instrumental" shows up on the SMiLE box I'll eat my hat. I just don't think it's real, and was just some off hand comment Brian made without really thinking about it to appease some fan who was asking him questions.

[pixletwin]

I always figured vegetables and I'm in Great Shape were "earth".

[bossaroo]

remember too that Brian was planning to make music with the actual sounds of water...

an idea that Steve Desper helped him get off the ground, but that Brian completely lost interest in.

[Jay]

I always figured vegetables and I'm in Great Shape were "earth".

I'm In Great Shape, as "earth"? I've never even considered that. But you know what? It makes sense. 

[guitarfool2002]

Again, I have to question the quote about the "unfinished piano piece". Seems really suspect to me. Just a vague rumor that's been floating around for years. When was that quote from, what interview was it in? Who was talking to him? I could be totally wrong, but I have the vague notion that the information was told to a fan over the telephone or something, so to me, it's just very questionable how accurate the statement is.

If "Unfinished Air Instrumental" shows up on the SMiLE box I'll eat my hat. I just don't think it's real, and was just some off hand comment Brian made without really thinking about it to appease some fan who was asking him questions.

I wanted to answer this first - This quote appeared in the Byron Preiss BB's book from 1978. Brian was interviewed by those doing research for that book when the BB's were studying and working at the Maharishi University (MIU album) in the latter half of the 70's, and I asked one of the people who did that research when he used to post on an earlier board about that very quote. It's Brian being kind of cryptic and vague, and he could be talking about any number of piano pieces, who knows -  but the quote is legit from Preiss' research and it was asked by one of the book's researchers in an official capacity, not as a random fan.

The context of that discussion on the older board was also about how Preiss scattered quotes throughout the book, and while it is overall very informative there wasn't much of a sense of context for the quotes, or where and when they may have come from originally. Hence the confusion over quotes like the "Air" comment in question.

Maybe that person reads this board and can chime in!

[Chocolate Shake Man]

But even in Cabinessence there is dualism. The dualism between the past and the future. The traditional atmosphere of the verses and the locomotive industrialization of the "chorus". Past and future, Heroes and Villains, Fire and Water.
And where do past and future meet? The present. To me THAT'S the subversion of the dualism idea. The idea that opposition is not really opposition. That even thought we have these two things that appear to be complete opposites, in reality they are totally interconnected and dependent on eachother.

I agree with a lot of this. I may qualify it for my own interests by saying that he does not quite subvert the dualism of past and future with the present so much as by suggesting instead that the present is always bound to the past. Indeed, we still live in a world that was built on exploitation. In this sense, the album thinks of time not as linear but, I would say, cyclical, hence the tidal wave of history in Surf's Up where empires are ruined and built up again and ruined again. It is no coincidence then that such a song would be called Surf's Up - a song that not only owns up to surf n' fun past of The Beach Boys but also reveals the revolutionary aspects of rock and roll that is at the heart of the music too.

[Dunderhead]

I always figured vegetables and I'm in Great Shape were "earth".

Again I don't think so. Is it just because Vegetables grow out of the ground? I'd like to hear more about why you believe Earth is Vega-Tables.

Quoting myself from a few posts above:
"I'd also like to add my thought that Vega-Tables is not at all about Earth either. The Vegetables in the song are drugs. On the early version of Vegetables there are different lyrics. "Tripped on a cornucopia". There is no way that line is not about drugs. We're talking about 1966 here, this is a psychedelic album, and Van Dykes lyrics are so infused with puns that it's impossible to ignore this lines connection to LSD trips. Vega-Tables is not a song about Earth, it's a song about spiritual and physical well being as a gateway to personal growth and enlightenment. The vegetables are not only the type of health food Brian was interested in (He did own a Health Food store after all, didn't he?) but also about the use of drugs as a source of personal actualization. Brian likely removed this early lyric for the same reason he did "Hang on to your ego", he thought it was too blatant and second guessed himself.
The recurrent belief that Vega-Tables is about Earth confounds me. It's based on nothing other than the idea, "vegetables grow from the ground". I really don't buy that Vega-Tables was ever earth. "

remember too that Brian was planning to make music with the actual sounds of water...

an idea that Steve Desper helped him get off the ground, but that Brian completely lost interest in.

This is why I really think Diamond Head is what Brian had in mind with all that water FX stuff. On an early tracklist for BWPS he included Diamond Head. I believe they asked him to put together a list of SMiLE songs, or songs relating to SMiLE and he included "Diamond Head", and also, perhaps more curiously "Time To Get Alone".

but the quote is legit from Preiss' research and it was asked by one of the book's researchers in an official capacity, not as a random fan.

Thanks for clearing that up! Really tantalizing quote. Wish there was more info on it.

I agree with a lot of this. I may qualify it for my own interests by saying that he does not quite subvert the dualism of past and future with the present so much as by suggesting instead that the present is always bound to the past. Indeed, we still live in a world that was built on exploitation. In this sense, the album thinks of time not as linear but, I would say, cyclical, hence the tidal wave of history in Surf's Up where empires are ruined and built up again and ruined again. It is no coincidence then that such a song would be called Surf's Up - a song that not only owns up to surf n' fun past of The Beach Boys but also reveals the revolutionary aspects of rock and roll that is at the heart of the music too.

This is exactly the point that Alan Watts made a lot in his book. About waves.
The Surf's Up lyrics basically talk about how institutions must crumble like "columnated dominoes". That all that artifice is built up, and clouds our ability to see the true nature of things. All the stuff about exploitation is part of that. The Micky Mouse version of history is one of those institutions that needs to come down in order for us to see things as they really are.
All the different dualities that I've talked about would have come together on SMiLE. Just like the past and future come together in the present. SMiLE isn't just about subverting history, it's about more than that, but that subversion is a big part of it. History needs to be one of the "columnated dominoes"

This is Brian's explanation of the Surf's Up lyrics:

At home, as the black acetate dub turned on his bedroom hi-fi set, Wilson tried to explain the words.

"It's a man at a concert," he said. "All around him there's the audience, playing their roles, dressed up in fancy clothes, looking through opera glasses, but so far away from the drama, from life—'Back through the opera glass you see the pit and the pendulum drawn.'"

The music begins to take over. 'Columnated ruins domino.' Empires, ideas, lives, institutions—everything has to fall, tumbling like dominoes.

He begins to awaken to the music; sees the pretentiousness of everything. 'The music hall a costly bow.' Then even the music is gone, turned into a trumpeter swan, into what the music really is.

'Canvas the town and brush the backdrop.' He's off in his vision, on a trip. Reality is gone; he's creating it like a dream. 'Dove-nested towers.' Europe, a long time ago. 'The laughs come hard in Auld Lang Syne.' The poor people in the cellar taverns, trying to make themselves happy by singing.

Then there's the parties, the 'drinking, trying to forget the wars, the battles at sea. "While at port a do or die.' Ships in the harbor, battling it out. A kind of Roman empire thing.

'A choke of grief.' At his own sorrow and the emptiness of his life, because he can't even cry for the suffering in the world, for his own suffering.

And then, hope. 'Surf's up! . . . Come about hard and join the once and often spring you gave.' Go back to the kids, to the beach, to childhood.

"'I heard the word'—of God; 'Wonderful thing'—the joy of enlightenment, of seeing God. And what is it? 'A children's song!' And then there's the song itself; the song of children; the song of the universe rising and falling in wave after wave, the song of God, hiding the love from us, but always letting us find it again, like a mother singing to her children."

[Mahalo]

Just wanted to chime in on "Fall Breaks...". It's not Fire, instead there was even a rumored piece of tape where Brian says something about walking through the snow while recording "Fall Breaks". Plus, a mid-90's interview where he talks about the track, if I could find it I think he mentions the changing seasons (or I could be remembering it wrong...).

...not debating. I am understanding of the title and past statements...I just hear the heaviness of that organ as something like roots, or dirt, or stumps- not the timbre of snow; and the percussive effects remind me of branches hitting together, the woodpecker at his work...-of course this interpretation is subjective as it is with all art. Is it Earth...not likely. Could it be? Well, was Brian smoking a butt-load of marri-ju-wanna at the time?

(I'm proabably just hypnotized by the cover- the green jungle of an exotic earth...leading to some weird hippie-shack with a Smile...)

[Phoenix]

...not debating. I am understanding of the title and past statements...I just hear the heaviness of that organ as something like roots, or dirt, or stumps- not the timbre of snow; and the percussive effects remind me of branches hitting together, the woodpecker at his work...-of course this interpretation is subjective as it is with all art. Is it Earth...not likely. Could it be? Well, was Brian smoking a butt-load of marri-ju-wanna at the time?

Ditto.  Big Time.

[bossaroo]

Is it just because Vegetables grow out of the ground? I'd like to hear more about why you believe Earth is Vega-Tables.

sometime during the original sessions Brian was quoted as saying that the Elements related to the "get healthy" theme.
in that context, Great Shape and Vega-Tables would clearly represent the Earth.

[Dunderhead]

Is it just because Vegetables grow out of the ground? I'd like to hear more about why you believe Earth is Vega-Tables.

sometime during the original sessions Brian was quoted as saying that the Elements related to the "get healthy" theme.
in that context, Great Shape and Vega-Tables would clearly represent the Earth.

First of all. How can two songs both be Earth?
Second of all, if the elements represent the health theme, how does Fire fit into that?
Thirdly, can you provide the actual quote? What session is it from? I don't think I've ever heard Brian talk about The Elements during the vegetables sessions.
Fourthly, if that were the case, how does either of those songs "clearly" represent Earth?

The lyrics to I'm In Great Shape:
Freshen [Fresh Zen] air around my head
Morning Tumble Out of Bead
Eggs and grits and lickety-split, look at me jump
I'm in the great shape of the open country [agriculture]

I guess I don't see the connection besides the word "country" I guess means "land" and land is Earth? If I'm In Great Shape is Earth than why not also Barnyard? They seem to have an equal connection to an Earth theme, because they both really don't.

It's a really vague connection that I don't buy. It doesn't fit. If the Elements are supposed to be instrumentals, neither of those songs fit. If The Elements are supposed to be an opera, or tell a story, neither Vega-Tables or I'm In Great Shape fits into that.

Also consider that Brian was strongly considering Vega-Tables for release as a single. If Vega-Tables was part of The Elements, how could it also be a single? That is if you have the notion that The Elements would have been one song.

Just none of it works. There's no evidence to support Vegetables or I'm In Great Shape as Earth. It doesn't fit and the only reason people think it does is because Vega-tables grow out of the ground.  


Vega-Tables seems to be about drugs. Listen to the early version, specifically the lyrics:

"Tripped on a cornucopia, stripped the stalk green..."
Tripped is a undeniable LSD reference. That line seems to be a pun for "I did a lot of drugs." the second line "Stripped the stalk green", I would guess is a reference to weed. The association isn't as strong as the first line, but it's not that big a stretch. Less of a stretch than Vegatables=Earth.
Listen to all the laughing on that version too. It's a stoner song for sure.
Also in that context consider the line "I threw away my candy bar and I ate the wrapper, and when they told me what I did I burst out in laughter." Hm...I wonder what he was doing that would make him do that?
Vega-Tables is a goofy stoner song. Not Earth. It's ostensibly about the Health Food that Brian liked, but it's a thinly veiled reference pot and LSD.

Also what's with the title "Vega-Tables". Sure you can just give a throwaway answer of it just being goofy and not meaning anything. But we're talking about SMiLE here. Why was the song originally Vega-Tables, and why did Brian drop that and just use plain Vegetables? I'm trying to come up with something. In Spanish "Vega" means "Fertile Plain" or "Tobacco Plantation", hmmm, that seems like it has the making of some type of Van Dyke Parks' pun. There is the German pun in the lyrics after all, right? But what about the Tables part? What could that mean? There are of course regular tables, but tables can also be some type of chart or database. Does Table mean anything in another language?

[Dove Nested Towers]

Does anyone else feel it was merely an oversight on Mark's part when he mentioned that the SMiLE bootlegs came out in the eighties?

I'm aware that it's been rumored about that most of the SMiLE material that has gotten into our hands for the most part escaped the vaults in the eighties but most of it wasn't booted until the late nineties.  I can't believe that Linett is unaware of the fact that since 1997 tons of "SMiLE" session material has gotten into collectors circles via the SOT releases and those like it.

Ah, I see you sort of answered your own question 

Personally I don't read Mark as a big SMiLE fan.  He's a professional, and will do an absolutely awesome job, but are we even sure he's a big fan of the Beach Boys music?  I know that's crazy since he's done so much of it, but I don't get him as the die hard fan we are.  I've even got proof!

When he recorded the 2004 SMiLE, somebody (may have been me) was talking to him on here about Good Vibrations, and how the original was recorded modularly, etc. and he basically just said that they didn't do it like that this time because they didn't have to (the band was able to play several sections, like they do live anyways).  If he was a fan boy, he would have absolutely recorded it in sections.  Or maybe it wasn't his call.  Or maybe that doesn't have a damn thing to do with anything.

Still!  Mark's great, and he'll do a fantastic job, but don't just assume he's a huge fan of the material, especially THIS album.  

Even IF he's not, A.B. sure as hell is, & will undoubtedly be treating this project with the T.L.C. that he would give his own child!